> Jeff:
>
> >Vangath's initiates will just have a Flight Affinity (and the other
> >two). Only DEVOTEES get Feats.
>
> Yeah, I know. Slip of the keyboard. I also shouldn't have said that
> _affinities_ are redundant when what I'm actually talking about is
> particular _feats_.
I would point out as well, that Vangath is a minor thunderbrother. Unless one is a devotee to him, they will only get the Flight affinity anyways. I suspect that devotees of Vangath won't be as common as all that. Possibly for reasons you cite with magic. Flying is a bit specialized for Joe Heortling. The less-useful-to-you Movement affinity is basically the price of doing business while staying within the bounds of Orlanth A.
Also, Vangath provides a single affinity - flight. If you prefer, you can always serve Vangath while being an Initiate or Devotee of the Thunderous or Allfather aspects of Orlanth (albeit at a higher cost in time) and thus not have the 'useless' Movement affinity.
> >>How is jumping over rocks or running over mud or up cliffs
> >>any
> >> different from flying over or up said rocks, mud or cliffs?
> >
> >Because flying has a resistance number for some of these things.
>
> And running doesn't? Or are you assuming that flying NOE is more
> difficult than at high altitudes? Why?
Flying is also blatant and has bad side effects for failing the roll -- you fall and hit the ground. Running fast is considerably less dangerous. And Flying NOE is MUCH more difficult -- if you think differently, then I think you should go and talk to anyone who's flown such as a pilot.
> >When I see a flyer, I tend to try to pick them off first.
>
> Sure, but a good flyer is better at dodging in the air than on the
ground
> anyway, so it evens out.
LOOK! There's a flyer!
The Orlanthi must be getting ready to attack, sir.
SOUND THE ALARM!
So much for stealth.
> >Movemnt
> >can be used on other people with little problem.
>
> Hadn't thought about that. You've got a point there.
The difficulty is a rather remarkable +40. And you can't carry a heck of a lot. If I'm cattle raiding, I'm going to be Movement oriented. If I'm going to be in battle, I'll probably use Movmeent -- flying makes you the archery target-of-the-week.
> Sunset Leap I'll grant you. I'm inclined to get rid of that for
other
> reasons, but YGMV. But I'm still not convinced that taking a short
flight
> to reach the top of a cliff or skim across a pond, for example,
takes
> more than an action, is a more difficult form of magic than any
other, or
> leaves the magician more vulnerable.
Sorry, I find Run over Mud or Leap over Stream to have a nice, simple 14 difficulty. At which point, they work. Flying may be easier, but I don't think so from a re-perusal of the magic rules.
I think so. YGMV. But flying is riskier and generally requires a higher magical competence... If you're actually playing/narrating the game with a flyer in the group, one discovers quickly just how dangerous it can be to the unfortuante flyer if they fail the tests (falling does hurt, often quite a lot).
Oh yes, the Fight While Flying ability acts as a 'cap' for fighting skills the same way Riding does for those on horseback. Its one more thing to worry about.
> So: the only convincing argument out of the bunch is the "use on
others"
> one. However, that alone is actually useful enough to make me
reconsider
> discarding these feats...
Well, its up to you. I think the arguements for the use of Movement are quite reasonable but YGMV. But I'm going to continue to post and comment on the basis of the standard rules-set. If only for the ease of those who are using the rules as-is.
Jeff
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