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Mikko & Nick :
> > Is it canon now that Elmal is missing his fire powers too?
No : It's mainly an artefact of the way the write-up was produced, and that some confusion persists between Yelmalio and Elmal (including in Heortling culture). But, there is some *false* Lozengicentric basis in the idea that at least some Heortlings believe Elmal has no fire powers to speak of, as Nick suggests. These Heortlings are wrong, but then again they never think to call on Elmal's greater fire powers, hence perpetuating the error.
> The full cult writeup in Storm Tribe has a Light affinity but no Fire > affinity (and only minor, domestic hearthfire-related feats).
But the final cult write-up in ST is unfortunately incomplete and sometimes, IMO, rather erroneous : some important Elmali mythology isn't even alluded to ; but more importantly, some of Elmal's major subcults (Torchbearer, Hellwalker) are not described in that source : which is NOT the authors' fault, I should add, but the hot sun on the pleasant banks of the river Rhine causing certain people to forget their Gloranthan continuity for a while .... ;-)
> That said, > I don't think the Heortlings associate the Sun with Fire, only with > Light, so this has never been an issue for them. (They don't think > Elmal is "missing" his Fire powers, because they don't think he ever > had any worth speaking of).
I disagree completely, except as suggested above : IMO the Heortlings core mythologies _do_ associate their main sun god with fire and heat (the opposite suggestion being quite bizarre, really), although they might be called "Sun" powers, not "Fire" ones : but, whatever else, I doubt these powers would be very much like Yelm's. No Elmali sunspears, rising on pillars of Light, all-seeing thrones on the top of bloody great big ziggurats, etc. But there's certainly an Elmal Torchbearer subcult, giving powers of lighting the darkness, starting fires, burning things, and of course having a great big Blazing Club to hit people with. He also has a fiery chariot, Heat, and Fertile Dryness powers, and many, many other attributes and powers, that a God Learner would ascribe to the Fire Rune.
Elmal's Fire powers are very inferior to Yelm's, of course, but * quite * superior to Yelamalio's.
And BTW, I think the minor fire powers given to the subcults described in ST are correct : but Elmal has 3, perhaps 4 other important subcults, not described, having much better fire magic : it's possible OTOH, depending what your Glorantha is like, that these subcults are quite small, or that Elmal's fire powers need rediscovering by PC Heroes, or that the whole Elmal/Yelmalio confusion thing has caused Elmal to lose them, or &c. YGMV.
Julian Lord
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<div align="left"><font face="Garamond"><span style="font-size:14pt">Mikko & Nick :</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Garamond"><span style="font-size:14pt">> > Is it canon now that
Elmal is missing his fire powers too?</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Garamond"><span style="font-size:14pt">No : It's mainly an artefact of
the way the write-up was produced, and
that some confusion persists between Yelmalio and Elmal (including in
Heortling culture). But, there is some *false* Lozengicentric basis in the
idea that at least some Heortlings believe Elmal has no fire powers to
speak of, as Nick suggests. These Heortlings are wrong, but then again
they never think to call on Elmal's greater fire powers, hence
perpetuating the error.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Garamond"><span style="font-size:14pt">> The full cult writeup in Storm
Tribe has a Light affinity but no Fire</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Garamond"><span style="font-size:14pt">> affinity (and only minor,
domestic hearthfire-related feats).</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Garamond"><span style="font-size:14pt">But the final cult write-up in
ST is unfortunately incomplete and
sometimes, IMO, rather erroneous : some important Elmali mythology
isn't even alluded to ; but more importantly, some of Elmal's major
subcults (Torchbearer, Hellwalker) are not described in that source :
which is NOT the authors' fault, I should add, but the hot sun on the
pleasant banks of the river Rhine causing certain people to forget their
Gloranthan continuity for a while .... ;-)</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Garamond"><span style="font-size:14pt">> That said,</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Garamond"><span style="font-size:14pt">> I don't think the Heortlings
associate the Sun with Fire, only with</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Garamond"><span style="font-size:14pt">> Light, so this has never been
an issue for them. (They don't think </span></font></div>
<div align="left"><font face="Garamond"><span style="font-size:14pt">> Elmal is "missing"
his Fire powers, because they don't think he ever > had any worth speaking of).</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Garamond"><span style="font-size:14pt">I disagree completely, except as
suggested above : IMO the Heortlings
core mythologies _do_ associate their main sun god with fire and heat
(the opposite suggestion being quite bizarre, really), although they might
be called "Sun" powers, not "Fire" ones : but, whatever else, I doubt
these powers would be very much like Yelm's. No Elmali sunspears,
rising on pillars of Light, all-seeing thrones on the top of bloody great
big ziggurats, etc. But there's certainly an Elmal Torchbearer subcult,
giving powers of lighting the darkness, starting fires, burning things, and
of course having a great big Blazing Club to hit people with. He also has
a fiery chariot, Heat, and Fertile Dryness powers, and many, many other
attributes and powers, that a God Learner would ascribe to the Fire
Rune.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Garamond"><span style="font-size:14pt">Elmal's Fire powers are very inferior
to Yelm's, of course, but * quite *
superior to Yelamalio's.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Garamond"><span style="font-size:14pt">And BTW, I think the minor fire
powers given to the subcults described
in ST are correct : but Elmal has 3, perhaps 4 other important subcults,
not described, having much better fire magic : it's possible OTOH,
depending what your Glorantha is like, that these subcults are quite
small, or that Elmal's fire powers need rediscovering by PC Heroes, or
that the whole Elmal/Yelmalio confusion thing has caused Elmal to
lose them, or &c. YGMV.</span></font></div>
<div align="left"><br>
</div>
<div align="left"><font face="Garamond"><span style="font-size:14pt">Julian Lord</span></font></div>
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