Re: Shrines and Temples

From: Peter Larsen <peterl_at_...>
Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2002 11:32:07 -0500

At 2:44 PM +0000 8/21/02, bethexton wrote:
>Note that this limitation of shrines doesn't bother most worshippers,
>because most are initiates who don't learn feats as such. However it
>is possible that you can only initiate into the sub-cult or aspect
>represented by the shrine, which could explain why Thunder Rebels
>suggests that in most clans, most of the men follow just one of the
>three aspects of Orlanth. They have a shrine to say Durev, so you
>can devote yourself to Durev through that Shrine, or initiate into
>other Orlanth Allfather cults, but you can't initiate into Orlanth
>Adventurous or Orlanth Thunderous there. You could at the tribal
>temple, but you'd also have to travel there for more of the
>ceremonies, which does make it easier to enter an Allfather cult if
>you aren't strongly pulled some other way. Given the progression
>factor with Ernalda it is possible that the rules are different
>there, or that somehow the loom house acts as a multi-shrine
>depending on who is officiating.

        I don't know -- I think shrine might mean somewhat different things, depending on context.

        All (maybe a Heortling all) clans have a temple to Orlanth and a Temple to Ernalda (the average clan with 300 initiated men and 300 initiated women of whom ~255 men worship Orlanth and ~255 women worship Ernalda should have no trouble supporting this) . I imagine that these temples allow people to worship Orlanth and Ernalda just fine -- devotees can get all the normal feats, all the normal sacrifices can be held, etc.

        Most clans probably have some subcults they give special worship to -- maybe they see Hedkoranth as an ancestor or they have a special fondness for Durev. Their temple has a "shrine" to that god in the sense that they put more effort into worshipping him, there is a godi to tend the shrine, etc. The godi may know more about the myths, feats, etc of the god than your average godi/priest of Orlanth (or even the specific aspect). Initiates of that subcult might even travel from friendly clans for specific holy days. I also assume that the god favors the clan and more worshippers are called to that god during initiation as a general rule. In this case, the "minimum number of worshipper" numbers are probably moot -- you could have a shrine to Durev without 50 (or 75 or whatever the number is) Durev initiates because Durev gets plenty of worship from all the men (and, to a lesser degree, women) of the clan. Shrines to Hero Cults probably fall into this category ("We have a statue to the Strong Man in our Temple, and we give him beer and beef on all the Holy Days. On his feast day the young men compete in feats of strength for his amusement. Currently, we have no one who worships him directly, but we remember his stories and the deeds he did for us.")

        Shrines to other gods are trickier. Let's say a shrine requires 50 initiates to support (I don't have HW:RiG with me, so I'm guessing). If a clan has a shrine to Heler, we have to assume that a minimum of 10% of the male population of the clan worships Heler. That's about 30 people, plus a few of the women and the odd Helerites from nearby clans to bring up the numbers. There's a godi who tends the shrine, but, while he can lead general worship of Heler, he probably leans heavily towards whatever subcult(s) he follows. Young people who want to worship Yuhurol when the godi follows Uroth are going to have to hope for divine inspiration or become resigned to a long trek to another shrine/devotee/godi to learn the myths and special secrets they need to follow their subcult. So, the shrine only "teaches" Uroth feats because that's what the godi can tell you about.

        On top of this, it's possible the shrine is the place to learn a special feat of, say, Yuhurol (perhaps Heler once watered this very spot with his holy person). The godi, devoted to Uroth, may know the myth and be able to guide the Yuhurol devotee on his quest to gain the god's blessing, but the godi won't know it himself.

        Or that's my take on it, in media res and all...

Peter Larsen