Re: Quick morality question for heortling

From: donald_at_...
Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 23:16:36 GMT


In message <421CC67A.9090701_at_...> Bruce Ferrie writes:
>
>Moah, platypus powaaa! wrote:
> >
> > I have a player who wants to play a gay character, and I'm wondering
> > how the heortlings handle it: is it a major taboo, is it ok, is it
> > tolerated but frowned upon, or what?

I'd be inclined to ask them what issues they want to include, just to make sure it doesn't upset you, them or another player.

>It's possible, though, that some "marriage of convenience" might be
>contracted, like a year-long marriage, just to produce children. I'm
>pretty certain that these would only take place under exceptional
>circumstances, though - to fulfill prophecies, or if the clan NEEDS
>population growth. I can't see the participants in such a marriage
>necessarily being very enthusiastic about each other, but needs must...

I think there are usually considerable pressures to produce offspring, preferably several. I can see a year marriage to produce kids being what your relatives demand to allow your choice of permanent partner. Equally there is a recognition that trying to force individuals into relationships they don't want is counterproductive.

>3. There is some mythic justification for homosexuality, from the myths
>of Vinga, Orlanth, Heler, Nandan (though, strictly, Nandan applies to
>male-to-female transsexuals, which is an entirely different thing), etc.
>In many cases, such dalliances may well be just that, short-term
>dalliances. We know from various sources that the Heortlings are pretty
>relaxed about pre-marital sex (and even pre-marital pregnancy, to go by
>King of Dragon Pass); presumably this applies to gay sex as well. The
>question is, then, what about longer-term relationships?

I've yet to be convinced that either Vinga or Nandan are about homosexuality. I would argue that they are primarily about a change of social role - like a modern man working as a nursery nurse.

>Particularly so given the legalistic/economic nature of Heortling
>marriages. If there is no same-sex marriage available, one of the
>worries would be that an individual who inherits clan property could
>gift it all away to a gay partner who, without the legal framework of a
>marriage, has brought no "bride"-price and owes no duty to the clan.

Individuals don't inherit clan property, individuals may become head of a bloodline which holds clan property. As such gifting it to a member of another clan in this way would be a breach of trust. That's assuming a homosexual becomes head of a bloodline, there's nothing published to say how it's determined and it probably varies from clan to clan. I would imagine it is usually a man who follows Orlanth who's married to a woman who follows Ernalda with preference given to mature adults with children.

>5. In certain areas, the confusion in gender roles associated with
>homosexuals can be mythically/magically significant. Note, though, that
>most homosexuals certainly don't act in any way like the other gender.
>That's another (rather pernicious and nasty, in my opinion) stereotype.
>
>Here, I must admit that I'm a little uncomfortable with the notion that
>"all" gay Heortlings join the weird and omnisexual Heler. Speaking as a
>gay man myself, it seems rather offensive to me, carrying the
>implication that gay people aren't expected to or shouldn't join "normal
>cults for normal people". I think the key point about, say, Heler is
>that his worship provides a "niche". You could look at it as analogous
>to the way that the world of the theatre has been considered a "safe
>place" for gay men down the years in the real world. It doesn't mean
>that you don't also find gay men in the army, inusrance industry or as
>lumberjacks. Likewise, gay Heortlings could be found worshipping any god.

I'd agree with that, followers of Heler will be at a minimum accepting of homosexuality but I don't think it's a cult of homosexuals or even bisexuals. Certainly there's nothing to suggest that most cults reject members on the basis of their sexuality.

-- 
Donald Oddy
http://www.grove.demon.co.uk/

Powered by hypermail