Everyone sees it as the leader sees it. The story is about Otlanth (Or St. Gerlant, or Waha, or the Red Moon, or whoever), so that's the "viewpoint" of the heroquest. Now, some people might see more or less if you are the one involved in a particular station (as the active participant, so when "Orlanth used Humakt to slay the enemy", the guy taking the part of Humakt/Sword/Death will "see" the station with more depth than the rest of the party, imo).
> > Even if you are different magical backgrounds,
> > you'll still see the same
> > thing. You may see it a little differently,
>
> It's that "little differently" that gets me
> interested. We've added all this complication to the
> rules with three different magic systems, now how do
> we milk it for effect?
Perceptions on the Hero Plane are the same (generally) as on the Mundane plane, those possibly more (or less, in circumstances) vivid.
> > If you are performing a quest where Orlanth fights a
> > Darkness Monster, and
> > some troll is doing his own quest where Karrg beats
> > Winter, they might end up in each other's quest
>
> (nods) yes, this is the sort of thing I was thinking
> of. Either accidentally, or because Tim the troll
> wanted to hit Harry. Though I think both are still
> theist?
Doesn't matter. Could be "Orlanth visists the City of Sorcerers" and "St. Whosit defeats the Wind".
> And at this point they're looking at the same thing
> (Orlanth/Harry) and seeing something completely
> different.
Not really - Harry is looking at Tim, and Tim is looking at Harry. Harry thinks of himself as a great warrior with flowing white-blond hair and strom-grey eyes, while Tim sees a blast of wind with icicle beard and diamond teeth. Harry's not looking at harry. Harry's buddies see Harry as Harry the Stormgod and Tim as a amorphous mouthy beast. Tim thinks of himself as a great Troll Warcaptain, with an aura of darkness, and that's what his followers see when they look at him. they see the icy wind blast when they look at Harry, just like Tim does.
If both are PCs, you'd describe it to bring
> that out. In this example you're describing two
> theists, and differences based on different stories:
> presumably if one was a spirit-magic-user their story
> would be different again, almost by definition, and
> the differences in perception due to that will drown
> out any differences due to using different magical
> abilities to see what's going on?
The change in story isn't so much in Magical system, but in culture. A Heorlting's Stories are going to be different from a Solar's, ot a Praxians, or a Black Horse trooper's, not because they use different magical systems, bu because they have different stories.
> Hmm, a nasty thought. If you've been sucked in as the
> opposition, you weren't expecting it, you've just
> found yourself on the Heroplane (or at Practice level,
> on a magcially enhanced Mundane), facing an enemy. You
> don't know what story you're in. You probably don't
> know theirs, you may not have one of your own that
> matches. What do you see?
> If you look down at your feet, do you see your own
> shoes, or the claws of the Monster Behind the Tree?
Your own shoes (or your god's shoes, if that's who you are representing. if there are rutial roles for you in an enemy's HQ, then there is a story and HQ that you'll know. Remember that these aren't extemporaneous affairs - you'll ecognize some aspects of the story your are sucked into - "Oh, this is when Orlanth met the Darkness Monster. Darn, wish I was prepared for it" rather than "Who what huh where am I?" If you are being sucked into someone else'sstory, then you have some mojo of your own -Fred Farmer doesn't just get sucked into a heroquest, Harry the Hero does (especially when it's one done by Tim the Troll).
> > but *if* you could "see beneath the layers", you'd
> > see that in this
> > particular instance of Harry and Tim heroquesting,
> > the Darkness Monster is
> > Karrg, and the Winter is Orlanth.
>
> And if I understand it correctly, on the HeroPlane
> seeing "beneath the layers" is very hard, but at
> "Practice" level its very easy. (And on the GodPlane
> it's next to impossible, but let's not worry about
> that for now). Biturian had no trouble recognising
> Rurik. What ability would you use to try to do that,
> anyway? Use your relationship with the other person as
> an augment, I expect? Or as the lead?
I think (though I'm willing to be proved wrong) that you are correct - in a "practice Quest" you are recognizably 8you*, just "bigger" or "infused with the [god/spirit/saint] - you "wear your hero light".
In the hero Plane, you are Orlanth, or Waha, or St. Gerlant. That's how you appear to your followers and supporters anyway. You might or might not appear like that to anyone you meet - you might be the Cold Wind, or the Summer Zephyr, or whatever, since the perception of you depends on the story the viewer is following and your part in it.
> > But if Hugo the Heortling went on the
> > exact same quest, he might meet the Dark Seductress
> > of Midnight in the place of the "Darkness Monster"
>
> If Hugo was one of Harry's followers, then what? At a
> tentative guess, what is seen by the party as a whole
> is determined by the "leader", and the starting
> ceremonies magically bind them together in a way that
> specifies who the leader is today?
The leader is the guy taking the leader role in the story. If it's "Orlanth vrs Aroka", than the leader role is Orlanth, and the ;eader fo the Quest will take the Orlanth part. You can't "lead" the party from a junior position - the leader can't be the guy playing the part of "Orlanth's Boots", frex.
> >The Dark Seductress and the Obsidian Dragon
> > don't represent Karrg,
> > the three of them represent "Darkness and things
> > that go bump in the night" to the hero being
> Orlanth.
>
> OK. So as a GM you need to look at the essentials of
> the plot of the story you're following and come up
> with an opponent that fits those essentials, not
> necessarily the specifics. Which is fun in itself, but
> that's a whole different can of worms. (Is Aroka "a
> thing that brings drought", or "a thing that imprisons
> my friend"?)
Right. There's always the "Surprise!" element. Imagine what happens when you realize that Aroka was imprisoning the person you though was your enemy!
RR
C'est par mon ordre et pour le bien de l'Etat que le porteur du pr�sent a
fait ce qu'il a fait.
- Richelieu
Powered by hypermail