Re: Gods verus Spirits, and more.

From: Peter Metcalfe <metcalph_at_...>
Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2001 16:45:59 +1200


Santo:

>What is the difference between a God and Great Spirit? What makes
>a Daimone different from a Spirit? How is the Godworld different
>from the Spiritworld?

The difference between theism and animism is the primarily the difference of method.

The theists use sacrifices to contact their deities. At the most significant level, the theist sacrifices a portion of his individuality as divine food for his deity. As Thunder Rebels says (p61) "The worshipper is the core sacrifice. This experience of sharing the Self with the Deity is actually the secret methodology of theist religions." Everything else in the sacrifice (time, black bulls etc) is chrome.

The God World differs from the mortal world in that:

          "Individual focus and expectation affects perception.
         Also, because of its own nature, the God World erases
         human individuality.  Even in their own god's home,
         people see and remember the divine magnificence in detail
         and glory, but usually do not recognize or even remember
         the fellow who sat at their elbow or talked all night."

         "In the God World, people see only what they expect or
         need to see."
                         Thunder Rebels p131.

The animists OTOH alter their consciousness (through a variety of methods) instead. Through their altered state, they can perceive spirits or life forces more clearly and interact with them. They can also contact the spirit world, where the disembodied spirits are. These spirits can be persuaded or coerced to become embedded in the mortal world to provide magic.

Unlike the God World, the Spirit World is "ever shifting" and "seems vague and indeterminate to other people, as if floating in a dream" NB p26. From the experience of Daka Fal ancestors, (as opposed to the theistic ancestors of the Orlanthi cf Thunder Rebels p94), a spirit is capable of retaining identity after death. What it lacks is a body (sorcerous plane entities would perhaps lack matter).

Since both the God and Spirit Worlds are real, the difference between Gods and Great Spirits, Daimones and Spirits can be evaded by saying that theistic entities live on the God World and animistic entities live in the world of spirits.

>How does an entity "decide" to switch sides?

Giving up a side might be a better description.

As a result of the Gods War, portions of the cosmos have become different in nature. Entities that had previously inhabited two such places (for Lhankor Mhy, he might have the Grand Library in the God Plane and a similar institution on the Sorcery Plane) will find the different natures warring inside him and his residences (the spells wreck unholy havoc in the Grand Library). Therefore an entity gives up his connections to one of those places (i.e. Lhankor Mhy decides to close down the sorcery institution) to get some peace and quiet.

For an example of an entity that chose not to give up one side, there is Urox/the Storm Bull.

>On a broader note - I'm also interested in trying to understand more
>about the Saint Plane, the Underworld (which seems to be part of all
>3 Mythic Otherworlds) and how the Uz and the Aldryami fit into all of
>this.

The Elder Races are connected with the Underworld and thus their mythologies can be conversant in more than one magic realm in a way that human religions can't.

The Saint Plane is a more potent version of the spell plane (more energy, less matter). If the Spell Plane corresponded to Chemistry then the Saint Plane would be Subatomic Physics.

--Peter Metcalfe

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