From: owner-runequest-rules@ (RuneQuest-Rules-Digest) To: runequest-rules-digest@lists.MPGN.COM Subject: RuneQuest-Rules-Digest V1 #33 Reply-To: runequest-rules@mpgn.com Sender: owner-runequest-rules@ Errors-To: owner-runequest-rules@ Precedence: bulk RuneQuest-Rules-Digest Sunday, March 8 1998 Volume 01 : Number 033 RuneQuest is a trademark of Avalon Hill Games. All Rights Reserved. TABLE OF CONTENTS Re: [RQ-RULES] Damage, Holy Symbols [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous Re: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous Re: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous Re: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous Re: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous [RQ-RULES] Another interesting bit from the RQ4 archives... Re: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous Re: [RQ-RULES] Damage,round two! Re: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous Re: [RQ-RULES] Damage,round two! Re: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous RULES OF THE ROAD 1. Do not include large sections of a message in your reply. Especially not to add "Yeah, I agree" or "No, I disagree." Or be excoriated. If someone writes something good and you want to say "good show" please do. But don't include the whole message you praise. 2. Use an appropriate Subject line. 3. Learn the art of paraphrasing: Don't just quote and comment on a point-by-point basis. 4. No anonymous posting, please. Don't say something unless you're ready to stand by it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 08 Mar 1998 17:23:06 -0500 From: Tal Meta Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Damage, Holy Symbols Kennjewlz wrote: > > 84 (maybe?) that combined both real & fatigue-inducing damage > into a mostly nice & simple little bit of Rules. Kind of reminds me of Palladium's SDC + HP system. With a little bit of MDC thrown in for weapons that only do stun / only do lethal damage. > Right before reaching the NegFtg level,the "average" human > character (STR11,CON11=FTG22) will be stumbling around at > something like -43 or 44% on ALL abilities. Actually, your negative FP level is supposed to be what you reduce your skills by (i.e. -11 FP lowers all skills by 11%). Leon Kirshtein wrote: > ENCHANT HOLY SYMBOL Now this has interesting possibilities... Hmmm... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 18:16:00 -0500 From: stancliff@commnections.com Subject: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous RU> Once enchanted, the caster may elect to move his spirit (INT and RU>POW) into the homonculous at any time, no matter how far they are from RU>one another (but not across planar boundaries), He can then observe and RU>communicate with anyone who is present in the room where the homonculous RU>is kept. The caster can cast magic (but his skills will change to RU>reflect the reduced DEX of the homonculous, and be further cut by 25% by RU>the restrictions of being confined within the bottle) but cannot perform RU>physical actions, as it remains trappedwithin the bottle. I am amazed... this is a LOT of effort for so little profit. It costs about the same, and is far more useful, to make another familiar. Bob Stancliff *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Mar 1998 20:40:06 -0500 From: Tal Meta Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous stancliff@commnections.com wrote: > I am amazed... this is a LOT of effort for so little profit. > It costs about the same, and is far more useful, to make another > familiar. And here I was thinking it was too powerful. I actually strengthened this spell over the one in GURPS... that one wouldn't let you cast magic. Consider the following... if you're more than 10km from your familiar, you can't do anything except call it to you. With this spell, you can return to your inner sanctum from anywhere on the planet (instantly, for no magic points!). Properly crafted, the jar that houses the homonculous should contain spell matrices like phantom touch (to turn pages), fly (to move the bottle around), as well as others. This allows you to access your books, give commands to underlings, tap into magic point stores, etc. Also, many familiars don't have the ability to speak, so they have to (at best) perform intricite pantomime to tell anyone what your message might be. All in all, a fairly useful spell, I thought. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 21:53:45 EST From: Delecti Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous Bob writes: << I am amazed... this is a LOT of effort for so little profit. It costs about the same, and is far more useful, to make another familiar. >> Well...not really. You can't cast spells from/through your familiar, at ANY distance. It has its benefits and disadvantages. I think that a point of POW for STR and DEX are not really needed, afterall it can't move. That would make it 2 POW, though you could just as well make it whatever you want, but I think 2 POW is fine for that ritual. Delecti, Lord of the Upland Marsh aka Scott Knowles, USA Coordinator for The Chaos Society http://members.aol.com/delecti/UpMarsh.html Delecti@aol.com http://members.aol.com/Glorantha/chaossoc.html ChaosSociety@juno.com "What if life actually *was* fair, and we somehow deserved all the truly awful things that happened to us?" -- Marcus Cole, Babylon 5 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Mar 1998 22:28:16 -0500 From: Tal Meta Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous Delecti wrote: > > Bob writes: > > Well...not really. You can't cast spells from/through your > familiar, at ANY distance. It has its benefits and disadvantages. > > I think that a point of POW for STR and DEX are not really needed, > afterall it can't move. That would make it 2 POW, though you could > just as well make it whatever you want, but I think 2 POW is fine > for that ritual. I kept the STR since even though it is trapped in the bottle, it CAN move around inside, and would be able to manipulate objects inside the bottle with it. (Although, this is a holdover from the GURPS version; if you don't like it, don't use it.) DEX, on the other hand, is a MUST, as that is required for a magic modifier. You might even want to give the critter a better DEX, at a higher POW cost. And of course, the sealing point of POW is for tatoos, etc., on a living being (even an incomplete one). *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 22:51:24 -0500 From: stancliff@commnections.com Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous OK, I grant that the homunculous is not worthless. It does allow you to have presence in two places nearly at once at modest cost. Compare it to a familiar for cost effectiveness and I would say you might want to rework the blood requirement, unless you only want it to be used by the evils. When you said it had to stay in a jar, I pictured a lab jar filled with fluid. It would have to be able to talk and move in order to cast spells and communicate. It should have some freedom of movement and be fully formed, not fetal, more like a nilmerg or a demonic imp, but without independent mentality. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Mar 1998 22:59:57 -0500 From: Tal Meta Subject: [RQ-RULES] Another interesting bit from the RQ4 archives... The following was taken from the old RQ4 playtest/discussion archives. I thought that the idea had enough merit to save for possible revamping in my own campaign, but never got around to it. From: jjm@zycor.lgc.com (johnjmedway) Subject: Attack/Parry System This point, however begs a question. How related should attack and parry be? The Pendragon system presents them as one, and I've been inclined similarly for years. Isn't there a pretty big diference in how you would fight and parry if your bastard sword and shield was changed to short spear and shield? Why should your shield skill stay the same? A few years back Rob Smith & I were working on a style-oriented combat system, ( intended to replace the RQ combat system ) where attack, parry, and gimmick effects were all rolled into one skill. Essentially the first digit of the roll would determine success or failure, and the second digit would determine the effect ( type of hit, type of damage dice, gimmick effect, etc.). Skill was broken down by attack/parry combo ( say Sword and Shield, Rapier and Main Gauche, 2H Spear, etc.). You did _not_ have separate skills for punch, kick, etc. 'Style' was one of: Duellist - Noble, reasonably fair-fighting, etc. Almost all 'hits' would be 'proper' weapon hits, in 'proper' locations. There would be openings for pushes and trips, where the character would have the option of taking or passing. Military - formal, though not stylish training in weapon and whatever keeps you alive, sloppier style, though probably more likely to get a 'hit' of some sort. Much more likely to kick, punch, spit, etc.( thus averages slightly lower 'damage', but more likely to have some effect, rather than waiting for a 'proper' openeing ) Free-style - anything-goes, dirty fighting with a high % of its attacks as gimmick effects, kicks, bites, gouges, etc. How you fight when you know you're a member of the food chain. This way you there was a difference between a 'proper' nobleman/duellist, and the veteran soldier and a broo. Of course, each style would translate to a lower value if fighting in a different style, as would similar weapons translate. sample combat skills lists: Noble: rapier/main gauche 75% (duellist) sabre 50% (military) [ translates to 25% duellist-style if trying to fight cleanly, i.e. against instinct ] Soldier: spear and shield 75% ( military ) this is _trained_ skill sword and shield 50% ( military ) this is _trained_ skill sword 50% ( free-style ) this is _learned_ skill knife 40% ( free-style ) Broo: club 75% ( free-style ) ( 2ndary attack might be head-butt...) in-fighting 75% ( free-style ) ( and disgusting ) from dim memory: 2nd Digit Duellist Military Free-Style --------------------------------------------------------------- 1 prime wpn. prime wpn. prime wpn. 2 prime wpn. prime wpn. prime wpn. 3 prime wpn. prime wpn. 2ndary wpn. 4 prime wpn. 2ndary wpn. 2ndary wpn. 5 prime wpn. 2ndary wpn. push/shove 6 2ndary wpn. push/shove kick/trip 7 2ndary wpn. kick/trip punch/gouge 8 push/shove punch/gouge. favored gimmick 9 favored gimmick favored gimmick favored gimmick 0 choose choose choose 'prime wpn.' should be obvious '2ndary wpn.' is off-hand weapon, weapon pommel, shield bash, ... 'push/shove' is a knockdown/back attempt 'kick/trip' is likewise, but handled differently 'favored gimmick' is much like the advanced maneuvers in RQ4 'choose' means pick anything you like. A similar parry/dodge table could exist. So, if skill was 50, a roll of 35 was a success, but depending on style, was either a primary weapon hit, a secondary weapon hit, or push/shove/knockdown attempt. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 22:56:46 -0500 From: stancliff@commnections.com Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous RU>stores, etc. Also, many familiars don't have the ability to speak, so RU>they have to (at best) perform intricite pantomime to tell anyone what RU>your message might be. All in all, a fairly useful spell, I thought. Only traditionalists, the desperate, and fools make animal familiars. The rest have human intelligence or better and can speak or learn to write somehow. Homunculi can have a place, no doubt. Bob Stancliff *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 23:05:35 EST From: Kennjewlz Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Damage,round two! Hey gang, Tal points out a mistake in my take on Negative Fatigue.. ME:>Right before reaching the NegFtg level,the "average" human > character (STR11,CON11=FTG22) will be stumbling around at > something like -43 or 44% on ALL abilities. Tal >:Actually, your negative FP level is supposed to be what you reduce your skills by (i.e. -11 FP lowers all skills by 11%). Well,Tal is indeed correct;each pt of Ftg loss( 11pts in his example) does reduce all skill rolls by 1% oops...... What I actually meant to say was: >Right before reaching the Maximum Negative Fatigue level(which would be equal to his normal Ftg level,only negative.(So Mr.Average'd have Ftg22,and a Max NegFtg level of 22 ,See?) The 44% loss on skills I was talking about would be the result of first gnawing through all of the character's normal 22pts of Ftg, PLUS the additional %age loss due to the character's 22pts of NegFtg being gnawed through as well. I was unable to remember >whether a character is supposed to pass out@ {MAXIMUM} NegFtg level,or if one can continue pushing on to even lower levels of bleery-eyed skill mods(as in beyond this -44%). What does anyone think? Be Fiann-valorous in your wounding exploits! -Ken Murphy- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 23:10:48 -0500 From: stancliff@commnections.com Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous RU>I think that a point of POW for STR and DEX are not really needed, afterall RU>can't move. That would make it 2 POW, though you could just as well make it RU>whatever you want, but I think 2 POW is fine for that ritual. I don't have any big problems with the concept. You should probably use the 'create familiar' spells to give it all the stats except Int and Pow. This is a variant spell, for the purpose of creating a servant body. The spell to give size probably takes excess muscle, fat and blood and transfers it to the creature being enchanted or blends it into the binding substance for unusual familiars. Bob Stancliff *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 23:28:40 -0500 From: stancliff@commnections.com Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Damage,round two! RU> >Right before reaching the Maximum Negative Fatigue level(which would be RU>equal to his normal Ftg level,only negative.(So Mr.Average'd have Ftg22,and RU>Max NegFtg level of 22 ,See?) RU> The 44% loss on skills I was talking about would be the result of first RU>gnawing through all of the character's normal 22pts of Ftg, PLUS the RU>additional %age loss due to the character's 22pts of NegFtg being gnawed RU>through as well. RU> I was unable to remember >whether a character is supposed to pass out@ RU>{MAXIMUM} NegFtg level,or if one can continue pushing on to even lower level RU>of bleery-eyed skill mods(as in beyond this -44%). In RQ3, a character with 30 Fatigue will take no penalty from fatigue use while their fatigue is positive. Every point their fatigue goes negative is a -1% to all rolls for any skill or check of any kind. When they go to -1 x Fatigue, they are dazed and incapacitated (like an injury), they fall down, and can take no physical action until they recover back into action range. No Con roll or heroic action. It is an interesting crock to double the -1% to -2%. Of course the whole issue only applies to very poor or inexperienced characters, because a character with a ghost or magic spirit bound will teach it End 1 or 2 and never go negative in a normal scenario. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Mar 1998 23:49:55 -0500 From: Tal Meta Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Vadeli Sorcery:homunculous stancliff@commnections.com wrote: > > OK, I grant that the homunculous is not worthless. It does > allow you to have presence in two places nearly at once at modest > cost. Compare it to a familiar for cost effectiveness and I would > say you might want to rework the blood requirement, unless you > only want it to be used by the evils. Well, I did put it forth as a Vadeli spell, and they've got a reputation for being, shall we say, a tad bit amoral? > When you said it had to stay in a jar, I pictured a lab jar > filled with fluid. It would have to be able to talk and move in > order to cast spells and communicate. It should have some freedom > of movement and be fully formed, not fetal, more like a nilmerg or > a demonic imp, but without independent mentality. I'm picturing something that resembles a Talislantan Bottle Imp. It looks partially malformed, but definitely humanoid-esque. If nothing else, the jar keeps your other familiars from eating it by mistake. It probably has enough instinct to take it's daily blood, but not much else without a directing mind. > Only traditionalists, the desperate, and fools make animal > familiars. The rest have human intelligence or better and can > speak or learn to write somehow. What have you had folks use? I've employed herd-men, monkeys, statues with spirits, etc.. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of RuneQuest-Rules-Digest V1 #33 ************************************ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. RuneQuest is a Trademark of Avalon Hill Games. With the exception of previously copyrighted material, unless specified otherwise all text in this digest is copyright by the author or authors, with rights granted to copy for personal use, to excerpt in reviews and replies, and to archive unchanged for electronic retrieval.