From: owner-runequest-rules@ (RuneQuest Rules Digest) To: runequest-rules-digest@lists.MPGN.COM Subject: RuneQuest Rules Digest V1 #77 Reply-To: runequest-rules@mpgn.com Sender: owner-runequest-rules@ Errors-To: owner-runequest-rules@ Precedence: bulk RuneQuest Rules Digest Saturday, April 18 1998 Volume 01 : Number 077 RuneQuest is a trademark of Avalon Hill Games. All Rights Reserved. TABLE OF CONTENTS Re: [RQ-RULES] Re: The campaigns RE: [RQ-RULES] The campaigns RE: [RQ-RULES] The campaigns Re: [RQ-RULES] Spell Fumbles [RQ-RULES] Sorcer spells Re: [RQ-RULES] The campaigns [RQ-RULES] Sorcer spells [RQ-RULES] Magic spirits Re: [RQ-RULES] Magic spirits Re: [RQ-RULES] Magic spirits [RQ-RULES] Magic spirits Re: [RQ-RULES] Magic spirits Re: [RQ-RULES] Magic spirits RULES OF THE ROAD 1. Do not include large sections of a message in your reply. Especially not to add "Yeah, I agree" or "No, I disagree." Or be excoriated. If someone writes something good and you want to say "good show" please do. But don't include the whole message you praise. 2. Use an appropriate Subject line. 3. Learn the art of paraphrasing: Don't just quote and comment on a point-by-point basis. 4. No anonymous posting, please. Don't say something unless you're ready to stand by it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:49:27 +0100 From: wal@eff.u-net.com (Nikk Effingham) Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Re: The campaigns >Nikk: >> >> And with that, has anyone ever seen a copy of Mike Dawson's HeroQuest >> rules???? I do know that he once, long ago, sent a copy to Greg. > >At RQCon II in San Francisco I played in a playtest >session for a heroquest system written by Greg Maples. >Mike Dawson co-GMed. Might that be the one? If so, I >don't think it has been published. It seemed very >scalable, but also rather complex, even though the >level of abtraction was high. I think that was the Epic system, more than likely. But I do know that Maples wrote that after Mike Dawson had a go at his own. Nikk Nikk Effingham http://www.glorantha.pcbware.co.uk/ "If absolute power corrupts absolutely, where does that leave God?" -- George Daacon *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:49:29 +0100 From: wal@eff.u-net.com (Nikk Effingham) Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] The campaigns >I wouldn't even dream of writing down stats for gods. They are simply too >different to describe in mundane terms. Encountering a God on a heroquest is >a different matter, there what you encounter depends, like the rest of the >quest, on a number of factors, possibly including who you are, what you >believe, how you got there, how you are perceived by your fellow >worshippers, and how powerful you are. All very much IMO, of course. I'd say that you could, feasibly, write down the stats for a God, but using a HeroQuest system to help would make it easier and more believable. No matter what HQ system you use. The problem with HQing (are HQing rules a discussion point on the RQ Rules Digest?) is that the stats of the gods change. Where do you encounter the God? On a HeroPath where he was defeated? Like Vivamort on the Terminus Quest? Then he should be defeatable by a "normal" Rune Lord. Vivamort on the Quest where he steals Air Powers from the Storm Gods he should be VERY difficult to defeat, as the HeroQuest says that you, the Quester, lost. Vivamort in his home on the Godplane, the "real" Vivamort should be the guy with thousands of percentiles etc... as he is the sum total power of all his worshippers put together. All IMO, Nikk Nikk Effingham http://www.glorantha.pcbware.co.uk/ "If absolute power corrupts absolutely, where does that leave God?" -- George Daacon *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:49:32 +0100 From: wal@eff.u-net.com (Nikk Effingham) Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] The campaigns > Beings outside time have stopped changing, they are locked in the >eternal NOW. Immortals within time have lost interest in improving >skills they have repeated for decades and centuries, so they eventually >stop improving. The time required for a new skill check is proportional >to your current skill, the better you get, the longer you wait. It >places natural bounds on the real values a creature is likely to >achieve, and each referee sets that bound himself. I would state that the actual level of a Gods skills would be dependent on two factors, what they stand for (Humakt would have skills in Weapon attacks, rather than Fast Talk, Uleria in Orate, Fast Talk, Human Lore and her cult skill - can't remember the name, whereas Eurmal would have a variety of skills depending on the situation...) and how powerful their cult is. Not how long they've been around. You could come up with a numerical formula (100 worshippers= 3% in a god related skill, 1% in a non-related skill, as an example) but this is all very useless to just about everyone. Just assume the Gods are REALLY powerful, run their skills in 1000's and be done with it. The best way to kill a God is to weaken his cult, re-enact HQs where he won and this time make him lose, so that the God himself, the REAL God, the ACTUAL God, not some petty reflection, weakens to such an extent that he can be killed. But unless you're a huge organisation like the God Learners you won't be able to do this. Certainly not singular PCs. Nikk Nikk Effingham http://www.glorantha.pcbware.co.uk/ "If absolute power corrupts absolutely, where does that leave God?" -- George Daacon *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:49:35 +0100 From: wal@eff.u-net.com (Nikk Effingham) Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Spell Fumbles >Anyone got any house rules on spell fumbles? Mine are on my web page, it's a >simple, small table. If anyone has any suggestions for results, please post >them here. I never did like Spell Fumbles, it was never as if the bonuses for a Crit were anything too nifty. Nikk *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 14:42:29 +0100 From: "Terje Tollisen" Subject: [RQ-RULES] Sorcer spells I have played very little Western settings, so I would ask for a few tips on sorcerers and their spells. Can a sorcerer have s skill in s spell he does not know? If he knows a spell, then looses it, what happnes to the skill? Can he get experience in a spell that he does not know, but he`s got a spirit with the spell? If a sorcerer has a bound spirit, does it matter hjow high skill the spirit has in the spell? I think that pretty much covers it. - -Terry *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 07:24:10 -0700 (PDT) From: allen wallace Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] The campaigns Nick....... I think that a different Experience system would be a Good Thing for RuneQuest. I don't know. The direct experience was what drew me to RQ in the first place. I could never justify the indirect systems like experience points or the Hero systems non-leveled version of experience points. The following illustrates my irritation. The great warrior to a young recruit... How did I become a great warrior, I went out and killed monsters and took their treasure... The great wizard to his apprentice... How did I bcome a great wizard, I went out and killed monster and took their treasure... The High Priest to an acolyte... You can see where this goes. At least in RQ you have a specific mechanic to limit your growth to what you actually do. Going out and killing things makes you good at going out and killing things. Taking treasure can fund your studies, but that is reasonable and gives the character more consistancy. Allen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:50:12 -0500 From: stancliff@commnections.com Subject: [RQ-RULES] Sorcer spells RU>Can a sorcerer have s skill in s spell he does not know? Yes, but he can't learn or improve the skill unless he is able to practice with it. That means he must have known the spell or have a matrix with the spell in it. RU>If he knows a spell, then looses it, what happnes to the skill? The skill remains fixed until he can refind it. RU>Can he get experience in a spell that he does not know, but he`s got RU>a spirit with the spell? RU>If a sorcerer has a bound spirit, does it matter how high skill the RU>spirit has in the spell? If he has an INT spirit with the spell it is the same as the sorcerer knowing it, not the spirit. No other spirit gives that ability. A magic spirit would have it's own skill and have to cast the spell using that value, not your's. Given a choice, sorcerers love INT spirits, POW spirits (or MP Matrices), and spell matrices. Bob Stancliff (stancliff@commnections.com) (http://commnections.com/upgrades) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 17:20:30 +0100 From: "Terje Tollisen" Subject: [RQ-RULES] Magic spirits (Thanks for good inout Bob.) If a character has a magic spirit, he may command it to cast it`s spells. But is the fact that it is bound in a matrix enough for it to cast it on physical things? Normaly a spirit needs to cast Visibility on itself, but is this not the case with a bound spirit? Also, how does this work for a fetch? Can the fetch cast spells on people without Visibility? I use that it can cast on the shaman, but not on anyboy else. Of course, the shaman can cast the fetches spells with it`s MP, but he would do the casting himself. - -Terry *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:50:19 -0500 From: Thomas Cooper Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Magic spirits >(Thanks for good inout Bob.) Agreed..you've been ENORMOUSLY helpful for me.. >If a character has a magic spirit, he may command it to cast it`s spells. But is the fact that it is bound in >a matrix enough for it to cast it on physical things? See, that's MY question; say my baddie Thanatar has a Intellect Spirit bound in a ring with Shimmer 4 in it's memory..& he sees the berserk Storm Buller heading his way...does he just say "Cast the Shimmer 4 NOW, Spirit!" and take 4mp from HIS own power? OR can he grab this power from his Bound Power spirit??(so, he got lucky & has both types of spirits ). I'm trying to get a handle on this BEFORE I actually have my PCs start saying.."gee I wonder how >I< can get more power to cast spells." This will be particularly important since 2 of them only have INT of 10 & 12, so they will DEFINITELY want more room for spells! Thanks! Thomas Cooper, Jr. thomas@onr.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 12:00:34 -0400 From: Tal Meta Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Magic spirits Terje Tollisen wrote: > > (Thanks for good inout Bob.) > > If a character has a magic spirit, he may command it to cast it`s > spells. But is the fact that it is bound in a matrix enough for it to > cast it on physical things? Normaly a spirit needs to cast Visibility > on itself, but is this not the case with a bound spirit? Also, how > does this work for a fetch? Can the fetch cast spells on people > without Visibility? I use that it can cast on the shaman, but not on > anyboy else. Of course, the shaman can cast the fetches spells with > it`s MP, but he would do the casting himself. I've always ruled that a spirit that has been bound is present on the mundane plane, not the spirit plane, and as such does not need Visibitlty to interact. The process of summoning and binding it basically rips it out of the spirit plane (which is why they're so generally pissed to be here). A fetch is on the spirit plane, but can use the shamans senses to target things, or can use visibility on itself for a better view. Logic for this is the number of magic spirits (even in the published mods) that get bound into "things" and then made familiars. The bronze dog has what look like eyes, but does it have 360 degree vision, I wonder....? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 19:34:46 -0500 From: stancliff@commnections.com Subject: [RQ-RULES] Magic spirits RU>(Thanks for good inout Bob.) I did a long post two or three months ago that was all over this subject. RU>If a character has a magic spirit, he may command it to cast it`s RU>spells. But is the fact that it is bound in a matrix enough for it to RU>cast it on physical things? As I read them, the rules say that a bound spirit that can cast spells can only do so on a person touching the matrix. To cast spells at range it has to have a magical vision spell to target auras. RU>Normaly a spirit needs to cast Visibility RU>on itself, but is this not the case with a bound spirit? Many spirits have visibility as a natural ability, such as ghosts. Others need the spell, but this is about spirits out of binds, not in them. RU>how does this work for a fetch? It is always in contact with the shaman and they can cast spells on each other and use each other's MP's. Allied spirits can make a concentration roll and cast through the priests eyes, but I don't see that power given to fetches. RU>Can the fetch cast spells on people without Visibility? I don't believe so. Some would argue that a fetch cannot cast visibility, only a discorporate shaman, but I allow it in my game. If either of these happen you should take away the added POW for spell defense that the shaman normally receives until the fetch returns to the spirit plane. Bob Stancliff (stancliff@commnections.com) (http://commnections.com/upgrades) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 20:12:44 -0500 From: stancliff@commnections.com Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Magic spirits RU>>If a character has a magic spirit, he may command it to cast it`s spells. RU>But is the fact that it is bound in >a matrix enough for it to cast it on RU>physical things? Spirits in binds have no perception of the outside world unless they have a spell for magical vision to perceive auras (2nd sight, etc). The only communication they have is with a being touching the bind. In my game, most binds are in continuous touch with the owner (ring, bracelet, headband, etc). If the bind is inside a pouch, then the pouch has to be grasped, if on a scabbarded sword, then the hilt has to be touched, etc. RU>See, that's MY question; say my baddie Thanatar has a Intellect Spirit RU>bound in a ring with Shimmer 4 in it's memory..& he sees the berserk Storm RU>Buller heading his way...does he just say "Cast the Shimmer 4 NOW, Spirit!" RU>and take 4mp from HIS own power? OR can he grab this power from his Bound RU>Power spirit??(so, he got lucky & has both types of spirits ). This is a bad example because INT spirits cannot cast spells, they only share INT with you so that you can cast the spell with your MP's. To use the POW spirit, contact with that bind is also needed, therefor the Int spirit in the ring on your left hand has no contact with the POW spirit in the ring on your right hand, but you have contact with both and can use both simultaneously since both of these spirits give their ability continuously without need for messages. Other spirits such as magic spirits and ghosts have to be commanded to perform a task. This is a visualization process, not real speech, unless a mental speech spell of some kind has been thrown and some words are known in common. This process takes time based on the complexity of the command. Since these are intelligent and conscious spirits, they should be trainable to respond to specific images over time, but if the spirit is allowed to leave the bind due to the command, then it will not return unless the correct controlling spell was cast during the command. All enchantments have to have a permanent symbol or rune to attach the enchant to or it will end when the symbol is removed. I play that if these symbols overlap, then they are in contact and a spirit in one symbol could access the MP Matrix in the other symbol. Others might argue that an additional point of enchant is needed to provide a continuous link between these two enchants. The rules do not address how large or small the symbol should or must be. If a tattoo was very large I would insist that the enchant is at a particular point. If a ring has a magic spirit bound to it, another enchantment can be placed on the same symbol for a MP matrix or a Pow spirit so that the magic spirit can use the MP storage. How easy this is, is mainly a house rule... you should definitely read the enchantment section carefully. Bob Stancliff (stancliff@commnections.com) (http://commnections.com/upgrades) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 20:23:26 -0500 From: stancliff@commnections.com Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Magic spirits RU>Logic for this is the number of magic spirits (even in the published RU>mods) that get bound into "things" and then made familiars. The bronze RU>dog has what look like eyes, but does it have 360 degree vision, I RU>wonder....? You are referring to Stranger in Prax. This is justified by the author under the create familiar rules that say that a being without permanent size has to be given a physical body... in this case it was bronze. That body becomes a Real body and the being can perceive from it in a fairly normal fashion defined by the GM. The book has the example of a spirit made into a familiar by giving it a body of smoke. It looks like smoke, it can act like smoke but will not dissipate, it eats... something (maybe smoke or charcoal). This is strictly a sorcery issue. Allied spirits are put into animals or solid objects. Bob Stancliff (stancliff@commnections.com) (http://commnections.com/upgrades) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of RuneQuest Rules Digest V1 #77 ************************************ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. RuneQuest is a Trademark of Avalon Hill Games. 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