From: owner-runequest-rules@ (RuneQuest Rules Digest) To: runequest-rules-digest@lists.MPGN.COM Subject: RuneQuest Rules Digest V2 #52 Reply-To: runequest-rules@mpgn.com Sender: owner-runequest-rules@ Errors-To: owner-runequest-rules@ Precedence: bulk RuneQuest Rules Digest Friday, March 19 1999 Volume 02 : Number 052 RuneQuest is a trademark of Hasbro/Avalon Hill Games. All Rights Reserved. TABLE OF CONTENTS Re: [RQ-RULES] Mysticism RE: [RQ-RULES] Familiars Re: [RQ-RULES] Familiars [RQ-RULES] More on Mysticism and HeroQuesting RE: [RQ-RULES] More on Mysticism and HeroQuesting Re: [RQ-RULES] Rich Allen's Combat RE: [RQ-RULES] Rich Allen's Combat RE: [RQ-RULES] Familiars Re: [RQ-RULES] Familiars Re: [RQ-RULES] Rich Allen's Combat [none] RULES OF THE ROAD 1. Do not include large sections of a message in your reply. Especially not to add "Yeah, I agree" or "No, I disagree." Or be excoriated. If someone writes something good and you want to say "good show" please do. But don't include the whole message you praise. 2. Use an appropriate Subject line. 3. Learn the art of paraphrasing: Don't just quote and comment on a point-by-point basis. 4. No anonymous posting, please. Don't say something unless you're ready to stand by it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 10:04:01 +1000 From: Robert McArthur Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Mysticism Nikk Effingham wrote: ... > This sounds good. However, I also think that Sandy's Mysticism > actually reflects current thinking in Glorantha. I think of the power > of "Unity" as being the Biggy, the one power that every mystic wants, > to be connected to the Universal "It". Now, it takes 100 Mysticism to > purchase this, not exactly the sort of thing you get out of nowhere. > If you're a mystic who spends all of their Mysticism on Martial Arts > and the ability to climb well, then you're never going to get the > Unity power, as you'll be spending your Mysticism on other things > instead. Foolish Mystic. If, one the other hand, you are an ascetic, > an "orthodox mystic" who spends all of their time meditating etc... > and never spends their Mysticism then you do in fact have a chance of > getting the Unity power. So that Mystic will have nothing to show for > all his hard work for a few decades and then will gain the Unity > power and be quite content. The game effects are tertiary to the fact > that you are now part of Everything and, as such, are Transcended. > IMO. Well, one of the results of such transcendence could be akin to the awe-inspiring 'power' of the superhero and dragon: total control of the magical flux around you (infinity rune in Dragon Pass terms). Effectively they could be immune to any magic they wanted to be, and possibly the same for physical as well. Of course, what reason do they have for a) being adventurers anymore (none), and b) being on the mundane plane still (probably none depending on your take of nirvana - they may be still around to teach, and perhaps their student(s) are PCs who think they want to become mystics, are lured by the 'powers' of the Transcendent, but eventually see that it's not for them [in a RPG setting]). Cheers Robert McArthur *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 22:18:05 -0600 (CST) From: Kevin Rose Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Familiars Two seemingly obvious problems with that. First, the link is one way. So the bad guys have no way of knowing when the sorcerer is within the appropriate range. And if they can somehow magically sense this they are able to affect the sorcerer directly, so why bother with this trick? The sorcerer doesn't need to get close. The people he cast his spells on need to get close. Second is that, for allies, the ally can cast all of his partners spells. So, unless you are into kidnaping non-combatants, you are likely to find that this is a really nasty problem. Particularly as the allies partner can add other people to the mindlink. Maybe lots more... That poor little shadow cat is much more impressive after he ignites the bag you put him in, with a shield 10 up, and starts tossing lightning, thunderbolts and sever spirits at you and you friends as they wait in ambush. It is a clever trick, but not as useful as might be expected. And liable to turn and bite you. Kevin > Even if you limit the range to 2 km, you still have a very good >plot device if the purpose is to lure the sorcerer into a trap or other >nasty situation. > Once the sorcerer is within range, you pummel the familiar with the >emotion spells. You could have the familiar kidnapped and held by >bumbling henchmen, giving the sorcerer a false sense of easy victory, >etc. > >Rich Allen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 16:03:22 +1000 From: Robert McArthur Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Familiars Kevin Rose wrote: > > Two seemingly obvious problems with that. First, the link is one way. So > the bad guys have no way of knowing when the sorcerer is within the > appropriate range. And if they can somehow magically sense this they are > able to affect the sorcerer directly, so why bother with this trick? Who cares, if you do it every hour. You *know* the sorcerer is going to come eventually. Anyway, it's a *plot device*. > The sorcerer doesn't need to get close. The people he cast his spells on > need to get close. True, but I still think that range doesn't change anything. Afterall, mindlink has no range (in RQ2, don't have RQ3 in front of me). Apart from magical means (eg. temples), the bond isn't broken so should work regardless of distance. > Second is that, for allies, the ally can cast all of his partners spells. > So, unless you are into kidnaping non-combatants, you are likely to find > that this is a really nasty problem. Particularly as the allies partner > can add other people to the mindlink. Maybe lots more... That poor little > shadow cat is much more impressive after he ignites the bag you put him > in, with a shield 10 up, and starts tossing lightning, thunderbolts and > sever spirits at you and you friends as they wait in ambush. > > It is a clever trick, but not as useful as might be expected. And liable > to turn and bite you. Don't have my books in front of me but IIRC you can't target someone you can't see (we sort of allowed targetting if you could cast detect and then, before it could move, cast an *area effect* spell). Spells on self *may* be OK in your game but the only one we allowed in ours was healing. Also, almost every spell has a somantic component. So, blindfold and gag the familiar and the familiar is pretty much goat-food. At worst, just throw a slave bracelet on it - but I don't know whether I'd allow the link back to the sorcerer in this case. (tied familiar can't ignite the bonds because it can't see to target them - feeling is *not* enough. YGMV) Robert *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 10:32:56 GMT From: simonh@msi-uk.com (Simon Hibbs) Subject: [RQ-RULES] More on Mysticism and HeroQuesting Nikk : > For instance, you might go on a HeroQuest and be tempted by a storm > spirit who will offer you his storm powers. You turn him down. Next > time Entekos (a storm god) will turn up and offer her powers instead. Bob Stancliff : > This seems rather childish... I expect better from Greg. >It is also very hard to role-play since a player can claim >that his character refuses something that a real person >might never be able to turn down. All you have to do is say no. The trouble is there are very real consequences to saying no. If it seems childish that's just because it's a very great simplification. There's an awfull lot more to it in practice (obviously). For example the mystic might have the opportunity to use his powers to save the lives and souls of innocents. He might be offered the opportunity to attain godlike powers, only to discover on accepting that he is now in fact a demon. Didn't realise that was part of the deal? Tough! The temptations are very real, but so are the risks. Every action has moral consequences and implications. Saving the imperiled innocent might be worth using up some power, but perhaps one of them grows up to become a mass murderer? Every action entangles you in a complex web of moral consequences. > Is it only Mystics who don't want to have divine powers? >I would assume that a deist would actually desire these and >seek them. Some mystics only follow mysticism in order to gain the powers. Sheng may well have been one of these - "Emperor of the known uneverse, that's the offer I've been waiting for. Thank you very much, I'll take it!" The risk is that offers and temptations are a bit like AD&D Wishes. You might get to be Emperor, only to discover that there's just been a revolution and you're being carted off to the chopping block. Hard luck mate - SLICE. Simon Hibbs *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 10:44:13 -0000 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] More on Mysticism and HeroQuesting >It is also very hard to role-play since a player can >claim that his character refuses something that a >real person might never be able to turn down. This problem isn't restricted to mysticism, it affects all aspects of a character's life. As a player, I can say that my character lives frugally, only buying on plain food, never getting romantically involved or visiting a brothel, always toadying to the high priests to get on in the cult hierarchy, never sneaking off from his tutor for a bit of recreation, always using spare time for strength training, etc. Do the rules need to legislate for this? I don't think so, this should be solvable by the referee nagging the player for unrealistic roleplaying. Opinions expressed may not even be my own, let alone those of any organisations, nations, species, or schools of thought to which I may be affiliated. http://www.snark.freeserve.co.uk/ Failure is not an option, it's integral to the o/s. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 10:02:01 -0500 From: "Bob Stancliff" Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Rich Allen's Combat > So where are the mechanics for increasing a character's stats through the > normal use of armor? Part of my character creation, and normal play, is to give the characters one free stat training check every year to reflect the rigors of their active life. People get stronger, healthier, more flexible, or react faster by constantly using their bodies. Training is in addition to this check. The check should be a low stat or one that reflects their most used abilities. > I just got used to carrying the extra load, but the encumberance was less. We have different definitions for the encumbrance of an object. I say that it didn't change unless you used up some of the stores in the backpack. Your muscles did adapt to the type of load, but does that need rules in game terms? The game encumbrance should be the value after adapting, not before. Initial penalties for carrying something new are valid, but so transitory as to be a waste of time. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 21:23:00 -0600 From: "Rich Allen" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Rich Allen's Combat > Part of my character creation, and normal play, is to give > the characters one free stat training check every year to > reflect the rigors of their active life. I like this... it could be expanded a little bit with some guidelines for the GM to use, including a way to use a stat check to go down in an ability. This can be used for situations like forced marches with only dry rations to eat, etc. I know, I know... I like to have a concept written down in rule form whenever I can. It avoids arguement later. > We have different definitions for the encumbrance of an > object. I've thought about this some more... So, the encumberance value of an object is weighted for after a character has gotten used to the weight. They may be more encumbered when they first use/carry the item, but quickly adjust. So, a character would probably be more encumbered at first, but the difference isn't enough to warrant a game mechanic for it. Is this close? Rich Allen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 21:23:02 -0600 From: "Rich Allen" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Familiars > Two seemingly obvious problems with that. First, the link is one way. So > the bad guys have no way of knowing when the sorcerer is within the Um, what? If the bad guy sits blindly in some tower waiting for the familiar's master, he deserves to get blasted. A smart bad guy would have look-outs, his own familiar if the bad guy is a rival sorcerer, keeping tabs on the guy, etc. He would have traps set, ambushes planned, mercenary cannon fodder in wait, etc. > It is a clever trick, but not as useful as might be expected. And liable > to turn and bite you. So what? The idea is to give the players something to do, not put them into an un-winnable situation. You make it tough enough to give them a challange, and then move on when they overcome it. Rich Allen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 08:16:07 -0500 From: "Bob Stancliff" Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Familiars > > It is a clever trick, but not as useful as might be expected. And liable > > to turn and bite you. > > So what? The idea is to give the players something to do, not put them into > an un-winnable situation. You make it tough enough to give them a > challange, and then move on when they overcome it. > > Rich Allen Point to Rich... this is basically why we play these games. Bob *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 08:17:47 -0500 From: "Bob Stancliff" Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Rich Allen's Combat > I've thought about this some more... So, the encumberance value of an > object is weighted for after a character has gotten used to the weight. > They may be more encumbered when they first use/carry the item, but quickly > adjust. So, a character would probably be more encumbered at first, but the > difference isn't enough to warrant a game mechanic for it. Is this close? > Rich Allen That was my opinion... Bob *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 09:50:19 -0500 From: Nikk Effingham Subject: [none] auth d0af0b15 subscribe runequest-rules \ nikk@MailAndNews.com - ------------------------------------------------------------ Get your FREE web-based e-mail and newsgroup access at: http://MailAndNews.com Create a new mailbox, or access your existing IMAP4 or POP3 mailbox from anywhere with just a web browser. - ------------------------------------------------------------ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of RuneQuest Rules Digest V2 #52 ************************************ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. 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