>Gollan's infamous stead is "thousands of years old" - which for me means
>that it appeared in the First or Second Age.
Given that there's only been less than two thousand years since the Dawn that's ruled out. The Malkioni have no problem in describing mythical events in terms of centuries.
>It isn't on the Dawn Age map.
It moves around. More importantly Hustula isn't on the Dawn Age map yet that has major mythical associations being where Hu the sword lived.
>Again I ask, why is it so
>important to you that the Larnsti predate Hendreik,
I pointed out the existence of Gollanstead to refute your suggestion that it was Hendreik that created the Larnsti out of scratch. To do so is not a personal obsession.
>remain really powerful
All that I am suggesting is that the Larnsti have magic like that in Storm Tribe and Thunder Rebels. That's not too much to give them, isn't it?
> > No. Hendreik is a hero. Post-dawn Heroes (non-Lunars) only provide
> > a feat (c.f. the examples in Storm Tribe). Greater power is only
> > available to theists through divine sources. I've already cited the
> > example of Alakoring providing a feat by himself and also one or two
> > subcults. This is an apparent consequence of the Great Compromise
> > that sets Gods and Mortals apart.
>Having game tested about a score of incarnations of hero wars and hero
>quest, I think this is just a game mechanic.
So name a post-dawn non-lunar hero which provides something more than a feat?
> > No. He appointed the nobles and sheriffs to wield Hendreik's
> > Freedom.
>What does that mean to you? To me, that is the kernel of a cool story
>idea and the beginning of a downward spiral for Hendreik's Freedom.
Except there's no downward spiral for Hendreik's freedom if you read other parts of the Heortland description.
While the Pharaoh ruled he changed many things but left their
love for freedom intact. Although their leaders have become
increasingly Malkionized, the Hendreiki still remain free
Orlanthi. For example, the warriors of the Hendreiki are not
thanes but western style knights. But the knights are not
nobles, just another of the free classes. Before any noble can
be appointed, he must receive the approval of the Hendreiki
beneath him. Bondage is so abhorrent that fewer slaves or
serfs exist there than in most western countries.
Glorantha: Intro p142.
If Hendreik's freedom was declining, then there would be a corresponding moral decay in the practice of freedom in the land.
> > I disagree strongly. The Freedom remained intact (although somewhat
> > damaged in the north by King Hadrad's revolt) until the civil war. It was
> > the presence of a New King that cared nothing for archaic rituals
> > that allowed the Kingdom to be conquered.
>Don't you think that Hendreik's Freedom must have been weakened if a
>foreign adventurer could seize power and end the Liberty of the
>Hendreiki?
I daresay the primary damage done to the constitution of Heortland was the disappearance of the Pharaoh and the lack of a recognized royal heir upon the old king's death.
> > The Heortlanders were not nearly conquered. All that is said is
> > that Fazzur won a clear victory over them and besieged the city
> > of Karse.
>Sure, but Fazzur knew that he could have taken them.
So he says. Whether he could have actually taken Karse is a different matter.
> > I disagree strongly. If Andrin was dumping Hendreik et al., I do
> > feel a lot of people would have noticed and complained.
>All I am saying is that he changed how Hendreik was worshipped and how
>Hendreik's Freedom was being wielded. Ultimately that weakened Hendreik
>and removed his protection from the Kingdom. But it happened slowly
>and without malice.
Again if Hendreik's Freedom was weakening slowly, people would have noticed.
> > I still think that the Pharoah would make one of the criteria
> > submission to the Pharaoh. It seems extraordinarily myopic
> > to allow a foreign conquerer access to the city once he has
> > conquered sufficient territory
>Maybe. But it makes a good story.
Still an implausible story IMO
> And when the Pharoah created his
>Holy Country there were no potential foreign conquerors.
Apart from the Dragonewts, the Praxians and the Western Barbarians? Also if one of the rulers of the six went rogue and denied the Pharaoh's authority, he or she could still enter the city according to your theory. Again this seems extraordinarily myopic.
--Peter Metcalfe
Powered by hypermail