Re: Re: Mountains in Dragon Pass

From: Jane Williams <janewilliams20_at_...>
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 2009 06:24:53 -0700 (PDT)


2009/9/4 Jane Williams <janewilliams20_at_...>:
> > Ah.... unless specified, I'm only posting here things that are potentially of use to
>> the world-wide Gloranthan tribe. A rather different approach.

> "Potentially of use" is an interesting phrase.
A little vague, I know. Basically if I know for certain that something clashes with something that's already out there and in use, then it's got a pretty good chance of being useless, precisely because of that clash. So while my own game may investigate what happens after the PCs retake Boldhome in 1615, that's not going to be much use to anyone else.

> Anyone can use anything in their games, that's sort of a prerequisite of YGWV.

Sure, in terms of general vague inspiration: I've used an adapted Traveller scenario before now, several chunks of Shakespeare, Gilbert and Sullivan, and quite a lot of Pratchett. But if I'm handing stuff out for general use, I want it to be of immediate general use: I should have done the work and the checking. If I haven't, my readers might just as well be reading Pratchett. Which is fun, but hardly the point.

> (Like a whole lot. For example: I expect our current game to result in
> the heroes thwarting the construction of Appius Luxius' Reaching Moon
> Temple. I should note that the our current games heroes are Lunars.)

That does sound like fun!

> There is a difference in presenting something for consumption by
> others and precisely describing things in absolute terms.

I'd say one is a part of the other.

> The relative elevation of the Stormwalk mountains means little to me - largely
> because it probably means little to the Orlanthi that live around
> them. If your players want that level of detail then great.

What my players will want is a mental image of how big those mountains are. I need to be able to say "think Snowdonia", "think Alps", "think Himalayas". To know which of those to pick, I have to look at the map, look at scales, dive into Numbers, and then come out the other side with an answer that fits. They will, definitely, look at a map, and say "ten miles, so that's two or three hours walk, probably a bit more if it's steep. How steep is it?"

> When you say "a thousand feet" I only know what you mean because I
> translate it into metres.

So divide by three: I was multiplying to get the feet, since half the maps used one unit and half the other. It hardly matters, as long as we have a consistent unit.

> I don't the people of Dragon Pass even think on this level.
I'm sure they don't, but they can tell three hours from a week, too.

> (Alpen?)

A rather famous breakfast cereal, from which I got my first experience of Mountains. It being "Alp"-en, it has a picture of the Matterhorn on it. I finally fulfilled an ambition by seeing the real thing, and walking in that region, January before last.

> > But if they're looking at the same map, and they all know it's 10 miles from A to B?

>Would this be an "accurate map of Dragon Pass"?

It seems so, yes. The RQ2 map agrees with the Dragon Pass gazeteer map, and as far as I know with most other maps. 10-20 miles, ish, or thereabouts. Sufficient accuracy that you can't just stick another zero on the end of the distance.

> I still don't see how having to say "a terrible hard pass to cross"
> needs to rely on complex geographical or geophysical data.

It doesn't, and we weren't using any. Just "how big a mountain can we fit into a 10-mile space?", by using examples of the steepest real ones we could find.

> Specifically, here, we have Penny Love's "Widow's Tale" as a source, giving a detailed description
> of that "last pass" over the northern Stormwalks, plus the DP map (with errata) that shows the
> distance across those mountains. (Incidentally, after Rob's comment, I pulled out RQ2 and checked
> the scale. It agrees.) Both of these are sources that anyone we write for is likely to have,
> and use as inspiration.

> I think RQ2 is as old as I am (1980?), I'm afraid I don't have a copy.

But since whatever map you're using has the same measurements, this hardly matters. Not that I have any idea what your age has to do with your ability to pick books up from Ebay... RQ2 had been out of print for a decade or so before I got a copy, either, and the seller didn't ask how old I was.

> I suppose I am not someone for whom you are writing? I remove my
> "hypothetical end user status" on this basis!

Eh? You are using *some* Gloranthan source material, right? And you'd prefer me not to clash with whatever you are using? Or, indeed, with anything you may get copies of in the future?       

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