Re: How many Argraths?

From: Chris Lemens <chrislemens_at_uT8FFzc7XshGUXws20PzFFUYzRbpywU_JWIOI24G14liL27g9LxdNqSg96jqOVZM>
Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2007 05:14:14 -0700 (PDT)

Jane asks, in response to me:
> > Maybe he got confused with another Argrath, who --
> > just, say -- lost the Second Battle of Moonbroth in
> > 1625?
> He may well have done, but what does that have to do
> with the Fimbulwinter of 1621/1622?

Nothing. You were speculating about reasons why Fimbulwinter may not have appeared significantly in the KoS texts. One line ouf throught was that Argrath was doing something embarrassing at the time. Losing the biggest battle of "his" life up to that point might count.

> Chris, . . .what's your take on AWB?

I think he's a Sartarite by birth. I think he becomes the Jaldon counter in the Dragon Pass board game. I think he assists (or is) the real Argrath when he returns to the Wastes via Gonn Orta's pass. I think he remains the connection that includes Yazurkial as the eastern Dragon in at the end of the history in KoS. I think he first makes contact with Kallyr in about 1623. The Bull has blown west for two years at that point, and he will have wanted to search out who was responsible for removing the effect that blocked the Bull's progress. That's probably when he makes first contact with the Bastard Tribe, too.

> I've always reckoned that to be an Argrath, some sort of descent
> from the Sartar Royal House is required. We had AWB getting it by
> being (or being descended from) a Sartarite taken as a
> slave by a Praxian tribe. Does that work in your
> opinion?

That is my opinion too, though I would leave it ambiguous -- nobody keeps up with the ancestry of young slaves. The reason we get a partially contradictory story is because of who writes the story. Plus Argrath would not, among Praxians, be at great pains to emphasize his Sartarite ancestry. It might actually be a surprise to many Praxians when he later reveals it. Also, he might be adopted by a Praxian chief in his youth, which would make his other ancestry irrelevant. (In fact, in magical terms, I don't see how he can avoid some form of adoption. Otherwise, he would have a non-Praxian spirit knot.)

> Also, ISTR we had the idea that he ends up doing what
> I think we'd now describe as "hero-forming" Jaldon.
> This being how Jaldon does his regular re-appearances,
> he gets hero-formed.

He also may have taken the name Jaldon. Think about how many Muslims are called some verion of Muhammad.

> Does that fit your understanding of Prax, or did us
>Orlanthi-thinking types get it All Wrong?

Stupid outlanders.

I think Bad Dream is the Dragontooth Runners counter. ISTR a KoS reference to his bunch calling themselves something similar.

An interesting question for me is how Bad Dream got in touch with White Bull. Why would Bad Dream have trusted him? Did Kallyr give him token of trust in 1623? Why would she do that for an untested ally who is also a crazy barbarian?


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