Re: Make up new Gods, dang it!

From: donald_at_AfkGEcnpiIO0Q3yIFkQvWUvLJUmh_wm4IOwE63y1_6Gxu-A2nLLkJoKvUGgt8iW4h1EVa
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 13:40:54 GMT


In message <cdd2ade10707160237o152f99fv830491b2764937e9_at_hbe5SQZEZ26-KLdZhTkUEIVwLnviQRKZZrUcXulUEBRFDKt7Mdkm9uD3Nj4dPIjfPRmMtqwD8OrKkGjfqPTAJvbRR49HVLoA-vnc5sBgDbmIECViI99CLP-L66EwJwJ3.yahoo.invalid> "Andrew Dawson" writes:
>> I have difficulty with the idea that a pre-industrial society
>> should have anything like 10% of the adult population being
>> specialists.
>
>MGPDV
>
>Even in a magical world? This seems, IMO, to be implying that magic is
>a replacement for technology, and that otherwise Glorantha should be
>based on Earth's history. I like the economic analysis (at least
>that's what I think is the basis of such statements), but I think
>there should be an allowance for the fantastic.

Yes, it's an economic and social analysis. The two are very closely intertwined. One of the things I've always liked about Glorantha is that the societies have a reality about them which is missing from most fantasy worlds. The problem of having a high number of specialists is that it requires the basic producers to be productive enough that they can support all the specialists.

>Production specialists such as farming specialists (like Barntar
>worshippers) can be (are, IMG) a net positive to a clan's economic
>prosperity. Weather specialists (O. Thunderous, Heler, etc.), if of
>certain more "productive" subcults, should also be able to offset the
>cost of their upkeep to some extent by helping the clan to prosper.

I'm assuming all specialists contribute something which balances out the cost of their upkeep. Indeed I assume their contribution is in most cases high enough to warrent a higher standard of living than the non-specialist. The problem is that if the Barntari gets too productive you create an underclass who's work is worth less than their cost of living. Which isn't the basis of a stable society.

There's also the matter of how much use a particular clan has for Barntari. Much of his magic is concerned with grain crops which means he has to have a plough, oxen, an allocation of suitable land for ploughing and the co-operation of a grain priestess. Of course having produced the grain you need to convert it into beer or bread. The former requires a brewer while the latter is very labour intensive unless you have a mill which aren't common among the clans.

Overall I'd suggest that initiates of Barntar, Esrola and Minlister will together produce two or three times the food of three cottars. Assuming a cottar can survive on his own production the surplus is available to feed chiefs, warriors and other non-productive specialists.

So why doesn't everyone specialise in these areas? Firstly lack of suitable land. Secondly lack of ox teams and ploughs. Thirdly you need a big labour force for a short length of time to harvest a grain crop. A single carl and his family would be lucky to get a fifth of his crop in by themselves.

>I can also see a reason for non-production specialists, like warriors,
>being encouraged to be specialists even if they don't want to be. If
>you have a non-producer hanging around, you may as well have him be
>the best he can be (acknowledging that there is a school of thought
>that warriors who concentrate on mundane skills are better warriors -
>not IMG).

Certainly there'll be considerable encouragement for warriors to be good. However OiD lists many NPCs of who less than half are devotees. These are all heros or close followers of heros so there isn't a direct relationship between good and devotee. In any case I came to the conclusion some time ago that a clan warband is made up of two separate groups. A small core of full time warriors and a larger group of young men who want to be warriors. The latter group will be initiates at best because they will still be helping with the farming and only a few of them will achieve their aim. The rest will get married and settle down.

-- 
Donald Oddy
http://www.grove.demon.co.uk/

           

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