Re: Early, or Late Event?

From: Terra Incognita <inarsus-ferilt_at_6WAdHsrb3ohkkQHHqsHcpoDXlbQM86Yvgw1MHV1UBF4oUBiGTV72zWYvb7f6V>
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 23:10:52 +0900

Thank you for your answer to my question, Chris.

> (Grammatically, you have to use all present-tense verbs.)

Past tenses are perfectly derived from my weak english ability and my clumsiness. I now have some self-confidence that we don't have, and shouldn't have concrete answer, thank you.

>Here's my pet theory, which others have thoroughly rubbished, but I like

I don't want to rubbish your theory. Rather, I generally agree with yours. But I feel my lack of some 'tacit understanding' of our recognition and perception to Mythic Age, and I am not sure whether I should want the answer or not, for the mood and atmosphere of Glorantha. But here are three questions 1), 2), 3) which may not be, should not be ANSWERED. See below:

>> there is no 'Time' before the 'Cosmic Compromise' at least in Heortling
>> 'Unity Council' Mythology.
>> So sequential events are subjective, like events
>> experienced by Valare Addi.

>Likewise, the turning of Zzabur's hourglass.
> I think that there are stories about why he turns it.
> Moderns often assume that means the passage of time.
> I think it was something different.
> More like acknowledging the Passing of the Subordinate Actions
>(which I just made up, since I know little about westerners)
> or something like that.

Malkioni is good example, for they are not influenced by "Unity Council". See below 1).

  1. In other words, it might mean that Cultures not influenced "by Unity Council", (like Malkioni Culture and Kralori Culture, even Dara Happan Culture rejecting Unity Council Influence.) might still think that there was "Time" before 0 ST, if I literally interpret the sentence, "there is no 'Time' before the 'Cosmic Compromise' at least in Heortling 'Unity Council' Mythology."

> And I have an impression that some events are not 'cause and effect',
> but resonances of each other events.
> See below my godleanish timeline
> table about the events of Entekosiad.

2) Another quick "resonance" example is some myths of "Lodrils", Greg wrote some in Entekosiad and many other documents like Belintar's Book, under the name of DidalaDalan, Turos, Ladaral, Lodril, Vestkarten, etc. These might be same gods from the point of view of God Learners. But Glorantha changed, and concrete identities of deities should be under the game rule of 'Great Gods', 'Gods' and 'Minor Gods', etc.

>What time does is that it allows us to relate events that are not connected
>by cause an effect.
> For example, I can relate events in Kralorela with events in Jrustela in
> the second age because they occur at the same time.
> But I can't usually relate events that occurred in Prax before time with
> events in Dara Happa that occurred before time.

I see, but how the distance of two cultures (Comparing DH and Prax might not be good example, not in geographical, but in mental) influences to the events? For there are closed two cultures which holds contrary memory to each other mythic age, like Darjiinites (strong anti-solar and anti-patriachial tradition) and Dara Happans. Darjiinites and Wendarians remember "Evil" Sun God (Story of 'Third Hatchling' (See Enclosure #1) and 'Brightface'.) wrecked havoc and don't remember any "Golden Age". See below 3).

>One interesting spin off of this is that it helps explain (at least for me)
>the meaning of the observations of the Dara Happans about what happened in
>the sky before time.
> We think of the progression of stars and planets and signifying the
> passage of time.
> Before time, it does not.
> Instead, it signifies causes and effects.

> Every time such-and-such planet crosses the sky, there is a reason for it.
> When a star stops shining, there is a cause for it.
> I think that those stories are a rich part of the (mostly lost) archives
> in Dara Happan cities.

3) Perception is subjective, and progression of lights of Sky might not be important for non-star seers. For example, I can read Entekosiad sequentially from first page to last page, as an experience of Valare. Valare saw the fall of Entekos in Gods' Second Error, and did it again in the violation of 'Daak'. It might mean that same events happened at the both end of ages, Wendarian one and Pelandan one, or perceived differently by Valare.

I suppose this kind of discussion appeared routinely in Glorantha Digest, but the archive is now dead, and that I have tried to recover other gloranthaphile's memory. IIRC, David Dunham taught us some method to recover lost web archive....And 'Entekosiad' was written before Greg made up the concept of Three otherworlds and Everything World. So the ambiguity and mysterious flavor of it might be now replaced.


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