Re: Changed magic in 2nd and 3rd Age

From: L C <lightcastle_at_pFslsWPq4fDZHhyDTwYTDOtzzOZzA_FNPjmDr4TIfiujYKEZjxSZJfq9G3rnu2qn>
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 01:56:35 -0400

Jeff Richard wrote:

>Depends on how broadly you use the term "heroquesting"

I do think that is a snagging point in the discussion, which is why I asked about it earlier.

>.Let's look at this for the Orlanthi (since they are the best
described magical culture in Glorantha).

Yes, but I do think that fact also colours everything else in that we don't have a good, well-described version of any of the other magical cultures, and so may be drawing all sorts of the wrong implications from the constant appeal to authority by Orlanthi.

Not to say that having all the info we do about them isn't helpful for examples sometimes.

> As explained in Sartar: Kingdom of Heroes:
>"There are three basic types of heroquests. The most common is a Holy
Day Worship Ceremony where the participants observe and support the gods to learn the power first displayed in that myth. A This >World Heroquest is where the power of the Otherworld is drawn into the Mortal World and sacred myths are re-enacted to gain magical benefits and powers for the community or the quester. Rarer and >more dangerous is the Other World Heroquest where key magical leaders are sent to the Otherworld to gain even greater benefits and powers."
>As an Orlanthi, I learn how to use my rune affinities through worship
ceremonies where I "observe and support the gods to the learn the power first displayed in that myth." Technically speaking, this is a sort >of heroquest. On the other hand, I do this something like 42 days out of the year and is not normally something I really need to play out.

Sure. So type 1 is what gives one one's affinities. Type 2 is for a special blessing for people or for the community. Type 3 is go over and get you weird magic/do something drastic.

Which of these gets you feats? Are those Type 2 quests that are just well known and well trod?

Now, are heroquests "theist" or "animist"? Since Orlanthi worship is mixed, presumably these are either both, or different for different days, or something.

>> a) interactions with otherworld beings do not necessarily require
>> so that new magic can be discovered outside the hero plane (I mean that
>> there is no reason why a magician could not ask a spirit to do
something in
>> a new/inventive way, invent some unprecedented way of using some Rune or
>> other, nor any reason why the spirits and gods could never give new
>> inspiration to a magician _outside_ of heroquesting)

>Chris Lemens can talk at length regarding spirit magic. But the basic
model is still there; the shaman uses the traditions of his people to interact with the spirits. Sometimes something new happens, and usually
>that is a source of fear and bewilderment.

The three types of heroquests still apply? Or no? Are basic charms gathered by the Type I kind of quest. Type 2 is used to bring/bind a spirit or fetish and Type 3 shamans wandering off to find new spirits?

>> b) creativity exists in Glorantha, magicians can have it, and the HQ
>> at least do clearly illustrate that magic can be creatively used by
>> non-heroquesting types (sorry, confusing typo corrected)
>I am a little perplexed by this. Of course magic can be creatively
used by magicians. When I call upon the Air Rune to fly, I am being Orlanth. But I am also being creative in my use of this. I don't need to
>invent some tiny myth where Orlanth flew over the enemy soldiers in
order to attack them from the rear; all I need to know is Orlanth is the King of the Air and can fly.
>But perhaps you are using "creative" in a different manner?


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