I quite like Chris's suggestion as to the flavour of interactions between an animist magician and a god/great spirit.
I note also Peter's suggestion that in the current conception of Glorantha a lingering benefit may be more appropriate than a feat borrowed from another god. Though at least in RQ I might prefer a bit of MGWV.
I generally envisaged this kind of interaction being led by a spirit-talker or shaman rather than a god-talker or priest, though maybe it would not be the end of the worlkd as we know it for priests to know feats that would allow them and their congregation to interact with the demigod with such close ties to their main cult as to basically be a subservient cult (e.g. some Orlanthi priests and god-talkers might know feats that allowed them to interact with certain lesser Thunder Brothers?)
Incidentally would it be the end of the world for a theist to know a few feats that enabled them to summon and control a narrow range of spirits that were very closely associated with their cult -- would an Orlanthi god-talker really have to find a kolating if he needed the services of a modest sylph, for example? Shouldn't priestesses of Ernalda be able to know feats that allow them to deal with common or garden spirits assocaited with their goddess (like belnans and drinans(?)), without the intercession of a spirit-talker?
Also whilst Peter's example of Iron Man is good, Iron Man is also quite atypical in that the 'feat' he teaches is quite like a lingering benefit anyway. Most spirit cults (e.g. in Troll gods or Gods of Glorantha, or in reputable unofficial sources like Tales of the Reaching Moon and the Book of Drastic Resolutions), have traditionally taught feats (formerly called runespells) or common magic instead. Though on reflection I like the idea of common magic learnt from spirit cults being in the form of Charms instead -- I think it involves more 'local colour'.
Picking up on Chris's suggestion, maybe the idea of conferring a lingering benefit through interacting with such a strange and powerful spirit is/feels even more like covert possession than what Chris described?
In game mechanics terms this is probably easy in HW. The process confers a lingering benefit if it works, and the rest is about describing how this happens in words, in an appropriate and interesting way.
I then wondered whether the process of being possessed by a greater demon in the unofficial rules for demonology in RQ (published in the mid-1980s in White Dwarf 44 and 46) could serve as a model for how this could be done in RQ?
If I remember correctly:
- There was a skill to create the talisman the magician needed in the ritual to let oneself become possessed;
- Before that the magician would need to use their Demonology (demon lore) skill first, to know how to make a talisman that was right for the possessing entity;
- Then the magician would have to summon the possessing entity.
- If the summoning and the possession rituals worked, the magician would be (for the most part) covertly possessed by an aspect of the spirit, and would enjoy a lingering benefit for the duration of the possession.
- Greater Demons were sufficientlky powerful that they would usually possess three people at once
Also is controlled, voluntary possession by a spirit ally an unGloranthan way to interact with a spirit, or is it merely an unPraxian way?
Richard Hayes
From: Chris Lemens <chrislemens_at_xA-ugapTmuEE6ROw6LCXpw12Ax-nRoM9HuE4CZES6_oUe0J2x0eEO7_K2HNDNx3BIFxwa-xO1lle8EGn-mg3Fg.yahoo.invalid>
Sent: Wednesday, 7 December 2011, 0:10
Subject: Re: Misapplied Magic
Richard Hayes ponders, among other things, how an animist interacts with a god to get magic.
My assumption, for Praxians at least, if that they use their normal methods of interacting witht he otherworld, but that they don't work all that well. That is, you still drawn the center circle, drum the beat of the world, and dance the giant dance. You travel to the spirit plane and start from good territory. But then you have to travel far outside of your own people's lands. Dedra shamans travel the Outland Passage, for example. There they can meet the Iron Man and attempt to bargain with him. But he does not bargain like the good spirits, or even the bad ones. He is an Outlander to the spirit world. Instead, he is inflexible and requires you to do things that make you more like him. If you agree, then he gives you his power. From the animist's perspective, it is still kind of like animism -- it just wasn;t a very good negotiation. But the real difference comes in what the god agrees to give the animist. Working from memory, I think that the animist
gets a feat (old term, dunno about new). In any case, it will feel very foreign to the animist to be acting like the god in order to do something himself or herself, instead of calling on a spirit friend. It will seem scarily like the god is proposing to possess the animist. So the shaman will probably do it wrong some portion of the time (which is how you explain the penalty).
Chris
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