Re: what is animism?

From: David Cake <dave_at_94TxkQioXo8ELNXj8R4_rorqZgb_bhPRiXYaFM8eQDIrQvkDQhw3T2-deNJ99Cg_uUnmX0K>
Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 16:41:06 +0800

On 05/01/2013, at 3:45 PM, "Jeff" <richaje_at_qw4eNRB0Ba75Uey1JSsA_z6V-NQkaX_TyEAgg0xgEKMR3lzth7enZZQ3hi1tTWuVty1wWHLUUKJwbAsJ.yahoo.invalid> wrote:

>> Sure, but can't you sacrifice to (or gift) spirits to gain magic? Treating them like little gods, even though technically they're not.

>
> Sure, and in that case - in the God Learner framework for understanding magic* - you are worshiping little gods, even if you call them spirits and understand them to be spirits.

        Yes. I think trick is understanding that the Otherworlds are not totally disparate 'places' in the sense that France and Germany are different places, but rather the underworlds are different ways of approaching or understanding magic. The same magical beings can be approached and understood in different ways. The Xeotam dialogues makes it clear that sorcerers deal directly with many of the same entities that other magical traditions deal with, just by very different means.

        (FWIW, modern syncretic uses of occult frameworks like the kabbalah show how this can work in practice, with a range of both pagan deities and various demons and other spirits being assigned positions within the Tree of life/ kabbalistic cosmology. My ideas about how Malkioni magic works in practice tend to mostly draw quite a lot on the kabbalah, as well as theurgy and a little bit of things like Dee's enochian system, mostly because I know a lot about those, and not much about Hindu philosophies)

>

>> (I completely agree that the rules never handled this well, and dropping the game distinction is a good idea.)

>
> IMO the rules handled such concepts extremely poorly and put lots of energy and questions into something that neither helped with game play or revealed insights into the setting.
>
> * This framework (theism, animism, and wizardry) is an intellectual abstraction and not something that any Gloranthan outside of a few philosophers hold to.

        Yes.

        It is also worth noting that 'mixed' traditions, that is traditions that involve more than one kind of magical approach (and there seem to be several such in Gloranthan history), for the most part do not need special rules to deal with them - they are naturally usually less effective or more difficult (as they involve spreading a limited number of ability improvements among multiple skills), but for the fortunate few able to effectively pursue such difficult traditions they may ultimately provide innovative and unusual magic options that may be synergistically powerful. This seems to me to be just as it should be, without requiring special rules.

	Cheers
		David