>
> Greg Stafford wrote:
>
> >Except in Loskalm, of course.
> >But mostly true nonetheless.
>
> And the Aeolians don't use the Abiding book either, if I recall correctly.
A large number of minor sects do not, if they predated it. Ethilrist's form of Malkionism ignores the AB.
> >Peter's approach using the Thesis is wonderful. I like the idea that it
> is
> >likely from, ultimately, Sog City teachings.
> >This is a great idea for a specific organization to utilize and
> promote, to
> >test and exploit.
>
> Yeah. I think the "thesis" approach makes sense for the Sog City-derived
> approach, I just don't think it applies to all Sorcery as the
> underpinning metaphor.
> Of course, that's because personally I am finding I like the idea of a
> very basic framework (You have to learn sorcery, and then it becomes
> something you know) and then lots of approaches getting to that.
good.
> >That is one presumption, but not everyone is a mini maxer, and I
> always try
> >to remember that most people are not, nor are they especially logical.
> I can
> >imagine grimoires dedicated to the growing of blue flowers, to internal
> >decorating, hair styles, poison control, etc.
>
> Absolutely. The old rules always bugged me in that the grimoires seemed
> so narrow, when I think a school probably has a pretty broad approach,
> rooted in a given philosophy.
> (And then you get branching schools, etc.)
Sure, for some.
> >Now, my reason for picking and picking here is that there is no one
> way that
> >sorceres do it, wizards, priests and so on; any more than there is one
> way
> >for us on Earth.
>
> Right. Exactly. This has become my view as well.
Hooray! Go forth and spread the word!
>If it was a thought process insgead, could we say, "Everyone who places
> >logic before intuition (fill in the blank)" or even "Everyone who
> believes
> >in the preeminence of Science (fill int he blank.)"
> >
> >However, we can easily say, precisely if we know the jargon, "Physicists
> >agree on the speed of sound, and therefore (fill in the blank)" or "The
> >Society of the Golden Dawn believed (fill in the blank) or "The
> >Neoplatonists believes (fill etc)."
>
Yes, and that is the difference: specific truth versus general half-truth...
>I would really, really love to see some of this debate energy going to
> >concrete Gloranthan constructs, whether they are philosophies, dogmas or
> >speculative heroquesting cults.
>
> Yeah, I'd like that too. And I suppose I should try and produce
> something like that. I think the problem, for me anyway, has been ever
> getting a handle on the West to begin with.
> From the time I encountered Glorantha, it has gone from Malkionism and
> the Abiding Book as the basis of everything to many more branches, from
> caste as immutable to caste as open to interpretation, etc.
> What the Abiding Book even says about things has never been clear to me,
> either. Maybe if I had bought Middle Sea Empire I'd have something to
> work with.
Yes, indeed. It is always helpful to have the sources for something when one
wishes to learn about it.
Or rather, I HOPE it would be clearer for you
So working without some common basis of understanding has been difficult
> for me.
> Hell, I'm not even sure if it is Generally Agreed Glorantha
I don't know squat about GaG, just my Glorantha. Sorry. I can only provide my current knowledge on it.
that a
> wizard/sorceror has to go to the otherside to get spells,
Yes, he does, to learn them. Remember that when a person is in the Essence Plane it always appears to be INSIDE something. To learn the spells, they seem to be inside a room, library, magical laboratory, etc. where they experience it (if they have prepared correctly) and thereafter know it. Once learned, spells are known, and access is faster.
or whether
> they can be banned from using their grimoire.
Sure they can be banned, but that will not stop them from using it.
> Personally, I sort of feel that the fundamental difference between
> common magic and specialized magic is whether or not you need to make a
> link to the otherside to get it. (No for common, yes for specialized)
Yes, and this is because most Common Magic is from THIS SIDE, not from the Other Side.
> As
> for banning the use of a grimoire/breaking the link people can make to
> the otherworld, I'm leaning now in the direction of that being a school
> by school thing. It depends on the relationship you have with the other
> side.
Yes, of course. If you have taken an oath not to use the grimoire, then do
it, you are screwed.
But breaking an individual's link to the Other Side (whether through
grimoire, spirits or feats) cannot be done from the outside. Maybe from
inside the person (!!).
Thus a given Saintly order of Gerlant might have it that they can
> excommunicate you and then you can't get your spells anymore and
> another, which is more into a Hrestolian view of chivalry and individual
> achievement might not have that at all. Your link to the Saint is yours
> and the Priesthood can't block you out - only the Saint can.
That's right.
> But it always feels like groping in the dark since I don't have nearly
> enough Gloranthan esoterica knowledge to make something work.
Sure you do. YGWV.
> >Then some of the debate and discussion could be around, "What would this
> >mean in (my) Glorantha..." and we could see some of the philosophies and
> >debates in the West emerge from this.
>
> >I don't mean that the scripture need to be written, but it might be fun
> to
> >start with what other Scriptures state (Dream of Snodal, etc.) and
> work out
> >its philosophical ramifications, which might have ramifications in the
> >social world (what they wear or eat, where they say, customs and
> >superstitions, who they like and dislike, etc.) Then the West will become
> >fleshed out, and the intracies of some of their feuds and magical
> strife be
> >visible for play, for publication.
>
> See, the impression one gets from the outside is that this already
> exists, but just hasn't been told to us yet.
I do not know what else I can possibly do to break that opinion.
Yes, indeed, I know lots and lots and lots about Gloratha that is not in
print.
Yes, I try to make myself available as much as possible through this forum
to answer stuff that I feel is essential, core, to Glorantha.
But I do not know everything. I can not know everything. And I know I will
NEVER know everything,
And it is YOUR GAME.
--
Greg Stafford
Game Designer
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