> I've listened to Greg describing mysticism at a few conventions. My
> memory is that he said something like this.
>
> There is this world that we know and see.
> There is the other world that we cannot see, where there are gods and
> spirits and magic.
> Mysticism is practice of achieving something that is neither of this
> world nor of the other world.
>
> (Apologies if I have mis-remembered).
Exactly how I have understood it from discussing mysticism and the East Isles with Greg.
So, as far as I have understood things, Peter is spot on. There is no mystic magic. Mysticism is by definition nonmagical and there is no mystical otherworld. There are plenty of examples in the eastern myths of mystics using magic, but that magic is like any other Gloranthan magic: originating with spirits, gods or essences.
"Pure" mystics don't use magic, but most mystic schools of the present day have incorporated worship, and magic, in their practice.
Peter's description of the four levels of worship in the East Isles sums things up very nicely IMO. I have a few reflections in addition.
Worship of the High Gods was codified by the High Gods Chaquandarath. During worship, the worshipper experiences the mystic state/the ultimate/liberation/... This is very difficult for mere mortals. There may not be anyone who can perform this correctly after the andin king Dech Oru razed the high temple of Vith in Hanfarador in the Mockery War (my speculation).
High worship is mysticism, but there are also mystics who use other ways. Mashunasan's method for example does no include high god worship.
Worship of the noble wrongs, I guess most modern day martial artists are in this category, but Sivoli for example did not worship any deities IMO.
As for Sivoli and Darja Danad, I'm with Peter again, they are not on the same branch. Sivoli was a student of Ven Forn, Darja Danad a Mashunasanic monk. IMO they are the founders of two different schools of martial arts, the southern (Sivoli) and the northern (Darja Danad).
The impression I have is that Darja Danad was a pure mystic, who didn't use any magic. He was very active for a mystic for sure, but I think Kabalt was never an active, deliberate magic on his part. His followers on the other hand couldn't reach this power, so they had to find a way to do it. By worshipping Kabalt they could get striking bolt powers.
Incidentally I also think Darja Danad was the most recent mortal to reach mystic liberation.
/Nils W
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