>Jose Ramos complains about the Deville stories aound his concept of heroism.
>Well, I have to say I'm not too keen on the stories myself. If these were PC's
>then they would be major powergamers - if only due to the abuse of their great
>powers and the certainty that they are invincible!
Powergamers are players who wish to gain power simply because they like to be hard and bully people. Its an ego kick and is very very dull. I get bored with such players very rapidly in my own campaigns. However, there is a difference between a powergamer and a player who is violent, powerful and deadly, _within context_ and as part of roleplaying the character. As you've probably gathered, I like violent characters myself but I cannot play a powerful character without having a reason or a belief that motivates such behaviour.
The most violent character I ever played had no stats higher than 13, most were below 10 and he wasn't particularily good with anything. (75% was his best attack and he had a 2 point bladesharp) However he was a clansman, honour crazy, as stupid and as stubborn as a stump and becasue he was surrounded by giants he hit people when they weren't looking and kept going until they couldn't move (ie dead).
He followed Arnold Judas RImmers belief:
Lister: "You'd shoot a unarmed man in the back?" Rimmer: "Of course! Its only a pity he's awake!"
You get the idea.
Is that a powergamer PC? I don't think so. If Deville was a PC, is he? No he isn't, and why? Because Deville can get more powerful easily within the Empire, he could be awesome in a few years. How? Give up his fight to rid the Empire of corruption and toady to the system. He'd be leading armies and provinces in no time. His very beliefs are the things that will bring him down. And while they make him strong in some ways, as several people pointed out, he is a man alone and as such cannot survive against the state without finding something else to back him and to work for.
Deville is _not_ invincible by any means. He's tough but very vulnerable too. If all you see in the stories is Deville beating people up and being invincible then I'm writing very badly indeed.
>I suspect that I've read too many Falco books for my own good (these are
>excellent Chandleresque "detective" stories set in Vespasian's Imperial Rome by
>Lindsay Davis). I prefer to see my heroes more like Falco - vulnerable and full
>of human foibles! (IMHO). It would be sheer heaven if we could have Falco-like
>fiction set in Pavis! Where is Alan LaVergne when you need him?
Then write about him, I'd read that too! Look at it this way though and tell me if you think I'm talking out of my arse on this one. Fantasy has gone through several stages over eighty years or so but the current trend is partially swayed by Political Correctness and by a general "de-militarisation" of the Western mindset.
In the old days Conan was a gripping hero, tough, honourable, cunning and damn well exciting and fun. No patsy but a real hero, a man ready to lay it all on the line for his word of honour or a kidnapped princess (volumptuous of course) without a second thought. Now Conan is considered "to simplistic", why doesn't he have social problems? If his father taught him sword play he must be dysfunctional? All that anger and violence, he needs counselling.
Heros in _popular_ fantasy now are too complex, too mundane. The moment a hero becomes like everybody in the RW, its no longer fantasy, it becomes real life which is precisely what I'm trying to get away from when I read. My favourite protagonist is Kane, who is malicious, vindictive and tough but surprise surprise, the Kane books are out of print. Why? Because most people don't like to see the bad guy win and Kane is about as bad as you can get without being Mansen or Hannibal Lector.
Did anyone out there watch the Star Wars trilogy and want the Empire to win? I did. I thought that anybody with ships as nasty, uniforms as snazzy and such a wonderfully unpleasant, unashamedly conquistadorial attitude should win over those whining maggoty rebels. I remember yelling at Luke to join his pa in the Empire Strikes Back and hoping the pair of them would off that old git, the Emperor and take over the universe. Of course it didn't happen because in the Hollywood universe the bad guys never win. That said have you met anybody who actually _liked_ Luke Skywalker as a character? Most people I've talked too thought Vader was cool but they resignedly said he had to lose cos he was the guy dressed in black with a wheezy voice.
Oh well, enough of my moaning!
Martin "Bad guys have no feelings too" Laurie
>Also IMO Argrath is one of the leaders of the Black Fang Brotherhood in Pavis!
>Or the New Teeth, as his part of the family is called (per KoS). Now *that*
>would make a feindish twist to the Deville story...
No reason why not, the Black Fang Brotherhood in my stories have recently been taken over by an unamed outside source, quite a few of the old guard are disaffected.....
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