I would say that 1, 2, 3, 4 are definitely recreation Quests (with the proviso that the way of Orlanth he was seeking had been lost and partly overwritten.
I would say that freeing Arkat and finding Talor are experimental quests and that the others I/we don't know enough about to be sure.
But also note that Harmast is a big cheese Hero, if not as big as Arkat then certainly the second rank Hero of his day.
>Here are the heroquests of Harmast Barefoot, a peasant who rose to duty:
>
>1. To gain awakening
>2. To gain the blessing of King Heort and Orlanth Adventurous
>3. To scout the path to the Hidden Gate
>4. To arm himself, wherein he gained his sword, shield and boots
>5. To ambush Jajamokki
>6. Upon the Lightbringer's path to the land of the Dead he discovered
> Arkat and freed him
>7. To regain his plough and sow from Jajamokki
>8. Upon the Lightbringer's path again he was wounded but returned with
> the keys of Kartolin to aid Talor, whom the Westerners called the
> Laughing Warrior
>9. The Sky Giant's Castle
>10. The return from the Court of Silence
<<SMIP>> Some very good points about the problem Nick has with 'rehearsal' HeroQuests. I would say that though the risk is less you are still risking real losses.
In reply to my query Andrew Joelson said:
>> (And since we've been touching on exceptions let's ask how Sir
>> Ethilrist manages to avoid this fate.)
>
> Sir Ethilrist is one of the typical examples given of a self-
>centered Hero (Harrek is the other). He isn't interested in Questing
>to help his community, he's just interested in helping himself. His
>community consists mostly of his followers in his White and Black Horse
>Troops, and the veterans/farmers tilling the land near Muse Roost.
> Perhaps Sir Ethilrist is the example of a Hero who can 'just
>say no'; he got what he wanted from HQ's and stopped.
Both good points but I would say that Sir E is a lot less selfish than Harrek. He wants to create and maintain a small community rather than become a god to a larger community. He keeps the secrets he got from Hell to a small group of elite followwers and avoids the pressure that becoming more powerful can lead to.
Alex on apotheosis:
>Not just that -- I'm suggesting there be a "cosmological" compulsion.
>That performing ritual acts, or even mundane ones with a related mythic
>"meaning", would cause you to be "sucked" on to the HP. And once there,
>you effectively have to perform the (an) appropriate quest. And this
>quest has the same effects of "will"/"bouyancy" as any other, however we
>choose to represent it.
Well, yes. What I am assuming is that the more stuff (POW/WILL Whatever...) you have invested in the Hero/God Plane the harder it is for you to return to the Mundane World. And each time you do the ritual that reinforces the new reality (every High Holy Day or every Sacred Time) you feel a force to push you towards permanent residence on the Hero Plane.
You can give this up by stopping doing the recreation. But then the new reality falls to pieces because it looses its capstone, the Hero.
>> I'm coming to agree with you that (Will or POW or whatever) costs must
>> be paid at the time of making the change. We need to do this to allow
>> for bungled quests and changes that turn out to be faulty.
>
>Good point. Perhaps this implies that the worst "bungles" are the
>apparent successes, since if you know you've gone wrong, you wouldn't
>complete the quest.
Yes, I'm sure the people who buggered up curing the Trollkin Curse came back home full of themselves.
"Well, that's *that* problem fixed! What? What do you mean?...."
>I'm assuming you _can_ simply abort a Quest, as His Gregship has said as
>much, though I'd be inclined to question this for "deeper" quests. Nor
>am I sure what interpretation to put on the sort of change to myth this
>would (or wouldn't) represent.
Arrrrghhhh! Where did he say this? And how the galloping fuck is it possible?
(Michael is seen tearing out his hair by the roots....)
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