Ah, yes. Of course. Thanks for clearing that up.
You'll understand if I don't simply take your word for it, I hope.
As I believe about a sentence about the camps has made it into official sources, I'll be relying heavily on Martins original description of the camps, not that I take everything in that story as being necessarily true anymore, just the best info we have, not to mention the original appearance of the concept. Martin, please leap in if you feel I'm misrepresenting you at any point.
>>The instant torture camps where also very much a mechanism
>>of the state for punishment of criminals and disidents, as you might
>>expect.
>
>It is too cruel for such purposes.
It is remarkable how cruelly states can treat their criminals and dissidents.
>Furthermore Kralorela would
>just simply execute such criminals for the Underworld to purify
>them.
Doesn't have quite the same terrifying effect. Oh, and don't forget that like most such camps (certain real world examples notably), the forced labour is exploited for economic benefit (according to Martins view of the camps, anyway). Plus, in Martins story again, they gain magical power from the souls of those who die there, AND its a handy source of zombies.
>>Sheng was not thrown in there because they wished to help his
>>spiritual progress, but because they wanted to hurt him.
>
>Which contradicts the published information that he volunteered
>for these camps, having served as an ordinary slave for a few
>years after his submission.
It doesn't contradict the published information at all. Why do you think they allowed him to volunteer? Because they hated him, and it was the worst thing they could think of.
Sheng had his own reasons for entering the camps - but to quote from that exact published source 'he volunteers for the worst punishment', apparently because in his pride he finds torture better than demeaning slavery. The Kralori do not think they are doing him a favour, they think they are taking him to the worst thing they can think of (not giving him a crack at the mystic big time).
(in Martin Lauries story that originates the camps, he has a choice of entry only in that he could have chosen death instead. Some revision has occurred since then, but I think its pretty clear the camps were always intended as pure nasty).
>I don't think the camp commanders, even if they exist, _bother_
>to check if an inmate is sufficiently enlightened to be released.
>The camp is supposed to be an all-or-nothing affair - no one is
>supposed to get out until they are enlightened.
Sure. And it is generally expected that most never leave, just get tortured, probably until they die or commit suicide. In Martins story, no one has ever survived the torture camps before.
There is a mystic element to the torture camps (and a fine mythic justification of them in Martins story, I think). But that doesn't mean the torture camps are a primarily mystic institution - there are a brutal tool of repression and punishment first. And sure, Sheng used the camps as a pathway to mystic power - but Sheng was a unique individual, doing what had not been done before and that astonished his captors, and not just because he made a different response to mystic temptation, but also because he got that far in the first place. Just because Sheng uses the camps in a certain way, doesn't mean that everone sees them that way, or that that is how they were designed. If the Kralori believed that the Instant Torture camps were a likely source of so much potential power, would they have thrown a hated enemy slave in there?
Cheers David ------------------------------
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