Me>>Objectively [Frenzypeace] are wrong in what they claim is the result of
>>their methods just as the Kralori are right in claiming to be
>>dragons.
>The claim to gain mystic powers and insight through weird
>behaviour, and they do. Sure they can only get as far as Atrilith - did
>they claim something else?
According to the myth, yes. The founder claimed to be his way was a third beside the paths taught by Mashanasanic and Marnali.
>>>[The Corvee s]till amounts to a large state apparatus, though.
>>No, it doesn't. Otherwise an anarchist commune could said to be
>>a state if everybody gathers together to plant the fields.
> No, a levy is enforced much the same as taxes (in fact, often
>became interchangeable with taxes).
And are taxpayers part of the state apparatus? No. What is the point of this semantic obscurantism?
>>But _quite_ _a_ _lot_ of power is devolved.
> Quite a lot isn't. Some armies, for starters.
Untrue. Read past posts for details.
>>But nonpayment of taxes is not what we are debating. What we
>>are debating is whether Sha Ming gets sacked for the _late_
>>payment of taxes (which is the stronger sense of the statement
>>in question) and that this is what Kralorela metes out to all
>>such cities.
>You seem to be hung up on this because you want me to say Sha Ming
>was sacked because it was rebelling, not just late?
No. You had stated that "But [the Kralori] do, for example, sack cities for not paying their taxes on time." as an example of the Kralori do not rule by Goodwill. I have demonstrated amply that Sha Ming was sacked in the last two occasions for rebelling and not because it wasn't paying its taxes on time.
Since the reasons for Sha Ming's last two sackings were much more serious than the late-payment of taxes, the Kralori rulers are far less oppressive then you claimed they were.
>but the fact remains that the rulership of Kralorela is enforced
>by the threat of military force.
No, it is not. The army is not there to uphold Kralori rule, it is to defend Kralorela from the corrupt outside world. In both cases, Boshan had been allied with the outside world (namely Pentan Horsemen) and so it needed to be purged. Large parts of Boshan are still ungovernable (due to the incompetent mandarins sent there, the recalcitrance of the local populace and the endless greed of Imolo Wen's family), but the army does nothing for the outside world is not involved.
>>But the Good Mandarins are sending people to what, in your opinion,
>>is a brutal tool of repression. Hence they are not really good,
>>are they?
> Ah, the good mandarins send only those criminals who are so
>depraved that they could never be rehabilitated normally,
But if the Mandarins simply order their execution, these criminals will be rehabilitated. So what need do the Good Mandarins have for the ITCs as penal institutions?
>>[Immanent Mastery is more than a thoughtcrime because it
>>causes] the practitioner to manifest draconic attributes.
> Which is a crime because...?
Premature manifestation of draconic attributes is a strong sign that you are abusing your cosmic powers for material gain.
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