> Julian Lord replying to Peter Metcalfe:
> >>until recently, the Solanthi were dominated by the Trader Prince
> >
> >Not quite true IMO ; the coastal Solanthi certainly were
Well, I was a little wrong.
I was thinking too much of the current situation. Horizontally rather than vertically. Bad. No biscuit.
OTOH, the old Trade Route in the Voilor most likely stretches between Bath and Fort Digger, and then down the Darkel river : pretty southernly, really. I think that the Traders main forts in the Solanthi valley must have been Peelo and Yellowstone, so as to control the rich sothern area between Bath, the Howler, the Pelushi, Troll and Ice Mountains, and the Temple of Peace.
They must have controlled Donali and Tallcastle too, in the good old days : Tallcastle is actually a bit of an oddity. A Trader Prince's fort in the middle of an Aldryami forest to control local human barbarians ? It must have a very interesting backstory !
My theory for this place is that it was originally *grown* by the Aldryami as their own stronghold against the Traders, but they lost it.
> (and still
> >are). But the northern ones (who are quite primitive) are more
> >involved with the Arstola elves (frinstance, they have some of their
> >settlements actually within the Arstola forest), while the more
> >central clans managed to hold on to a certain precarious independance
> >(sandwiched as they were between several difficult customers).
> Beware that the coastal Solanthi have no contact with the Trader Princes and
> rather draw material sophistication on possible trade with the New Coast
> cities, which are a distinct bunch, and more recent.
Perhaps : I inferred from TotRM info that trade along the South Coast was dominated by Westerners though (and the Closing - which is still in effect despite Dormal's ritual - still forces most mariners to hug the coast), and my assumption has always been that the Trader Princes abandoned the inlands to set up shop & port on the South Coast (they must, after all, have gone somewhere). An error of strategy, certainly, to leave the inlanders such a free hand in the upper valleys ; also, rather bad luck that the Ship appears in the Sky a few years later to finally end the Closing and make those ports virtually useless to everybody but those inland tribespeople themselves : and sandwiching those same Newcoasters between inlanders, uplanders, islanders, pirates, Aldryami, mermen, and Waertagi. Ouch.
Also, the Solanthi draw material sophistication not from Trade, but from smashing rich peoples' faces in, and plunder. And from no longer having to pay taxes to foreigners.
Certainly, the more primitive members of the Tribe seem to be running the current politics.
When I said 'sophisticated' I really meant that they are a pretty varied bunch, but currently forming a strong confederation ; some of these under Western influence as you and Peter have suggested ("knights" AKA weaponthanes frinstance) ; but some Haranding clans actually get on quite well with the Aldryami (for the time being), some are the usual Thunder Rebel type, a few Wenelian clans may be Heortlings, and many more are the primitive piggy type described in several places. These being enfranchised by Greymane & co.
> Back in the Princes'
> time, there was no point at opening a road along the sea,
Also, the best overland route is along the river valley that stretches westwards from Esrolia, and south of the Ditali lands. Into the heart of Solanthi territory. Good raiding route, too. Especially without any of that soulless Trader scum getting in the way.
I think that the Traders would have controlled the Trade Routes more than anything else ; in the Solanthi valley: the Road and the River.
Please note that the highlands of the Southern Voilor valley are controlled NOT by Solanthi, but by trolls, dwarfs, and volcano worshippers. Perhaps some Vadrudi, too.
I believe that the southern lowlands are currently (and have been for living memory) controlled by the Traders.
"Peelo" is hardly a Solanthi name, nor is Maldros IMO.
Looks like Peelo & the Pelushi Volcano have a similar origin : IMG I had it as a non-Solanthi settlement taken over by the Traders, and recently transformed into a port by the Prince of Maldros and his knights, freshly retreated from various inland positions.
Well ; at least they'll have a better escape route next time round.
> The New Coasters came with the Reopening and don't
> acknowledge the Princes' claims to ruling them.
Inevitable balkanisation IMO : there's no longer enough trade along the Road to keep the Trade Federation together, nor continue successfully repressing the natives. The Traders will certainly have lost some of their coastal settlements from lack of overland support.
> Of course, those very claims imply the Princes somehow maintain a presence
> in the river valley of Voilor and can somehow justify them.
Yes : in the South. Only solution that makes sense, regarding Greymane's recent successes.
> >Some more of it comes from their relationship with the elves : their
> >"sophistication" is certainly relative, but they are more sophisticated
> >than the Ditali, and any other Wenelian group for that matter.
>
> They have a lot of friendly ties with the Ditali (Hey, friends, what about
> raiding Esrolia?).
The Ditali are a complex bunch.
Some are allied with Malkioni overlords, and behave quite properly (it is not in their lords' interest that they do otherwise, really. There is NO WAY that the Ditali Lords could survive a full-scale war with Esrolia, at least not without the full support of their subjects). But their rebels seem to be quite willing to go off and fight a third party (the Esrolians), despite the fact that the instigators of these raids (the Solanthi) are actually using them as front-line troops and as a shield against Esrolian retaliation. Possibly, the Malkioni overlords are covertly playing their rebels off against the Esrolians, in a complex three-way chess-game : which is going to go drastically wrong when the Aldryami join in too. Alternatively, they keep control of the towns, but have lost control of the countryside ; and the Rebels hope for nothing less than severe Esrolian retaliation against their "masters".
Perhaps the Ditali are simply so misogynous that they don't care anymore ?
Julian Lord
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