>Me> However it is published as a society where people worship both
> > gods and the Invisible God (cf the descriptions of both Henotheism
> > and Stygianism on page 53 of the Glorantha: Intro). That makes
> > it a society which Misapplied worship is at the very least "heavily"
> > used and it was in discussing the Safelstrans that Greg first started
> > talking about misapplied worship.
>I often wonder if they actually venerate gods, or simply sacrifice to
>them.
If they sacrifice to gods and venerate the Invisible God at the same time then they are still doing misapplied worship or should suffer an equivalent penalty because they are trying to approach magic from two different ways. Not actually covered in the rules, but what prevents the worshippers of the Tarshite Flamebringer Temple from simply venerating him and avoiding all those misapplied worship penalties? Or the worshippers of Saint Dormal furtively conducting sacrifices to his divine aspect deep within their temples while openly venerating him for the Open Seas spell?
In any case, the Trader Princes (from Ralios) noted in the Glorantha: Intro p150 for their "willingness to worship the pagan gods in their own unusual manner". This was a reflection of my notions about Ralian henotheism at the time being:
What scandalizes foreign Malkioni when they visit a Stygian Church are the shrines to False Gods. The Stygians protest that they venerate Saints, and this is true, but the presence of such saints as Quicksilver, the Patron Saint of Alchemy, casts a decidedly heterodox atmosphere. Analogues of the Orlanthi Gods are the most common of Stygian Saints, but the Gods of Trolls, Dwarves and even Elves can all be found disguised as Saints.
What is now written in the Glorantha: Intro is different. As well as restricting the range of worship (to Galanini, Hsunchen and Orlanthi), it implies that the majority of pagan worship takes place according to traditional rituals.
>I seem to recall that this practice was popular until the
>Return to Rightness movement.
We should really be clear about what we are arguing about. There are a number of different ways in which Malkionism and Theism can co-exist within the same society.
In the above places (save for the Carmanians) there are no overt temples to the pagan gods for it is a Malkioni tenet that they are false. A peasant might worship at a simple shrine, but anything more ornate is liable for demolition by the Malkioni. One could treat Safelster as another Carmania but I'm not a great fan of this.
2. The Pagans and Malkioni are mixed throughout all levels of society,
but pagans do not participate in Malkioni rites and vice versa.
My preference is for a range of possible behaviour depending on the city's particular interpretation of the Arkat myth. I expect however that the society which has a most thorough fusion of Malkioni and Pagan beliefs is the (non-Arkati) Henotheist Church.
> > There are also the Malkioni of Umathela of whom the majority also
> > worship pagan gods.
>I'm not sure I agree with "majority," but it's certainly common.
I've been informed (by both Greg and Sandy on separate occasions) that the Sedalpists are in a minority (perhaps as little as 2-10%), although this is largely masked by the spiritual intensity of the Sedalpists. Of the remainder only a few are Vadeli (45,000 compared to 800,000 Malkioni from ToTRM#10). The number of loons like the Cult of Silence and Ebbeshal are not known, but they are unlikely to make up the majority.
--Peter Metcalfe
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