On Mon, Dec 27, 2010 at 7:25 AM, <donald_at_SS2EXT_Cvwk1-QmV7TGG-WOI9f88l2fbAWh-64JLdd6xaKHCKRcqu6KRrxACDKgXbfEusDsuMk_d6WDS4yLy.yahoo.invalid> wrote:
> > But if you're a malkioni... all you have is FAITH.
>
In Gloranthan terms, this is an incorrect statement.
It is the statement of an outsider.
And by using the word, we load it with the baggage of our language
In fact, as a Malkioni, more than the modern term of "faith" is known: Joy
is an experience
they also have requirements: right action etc is necessary to properly live
int he world
In RW, Religious Faith is "a
> > firm trust in things that one hopes, a demonstration of things one cannot
> see"
> > (Hebrews 11-1).
>
The Hebriac Bible is one expression of Faith, but not the only one.
> I do think that contemporary, western intellectuals like us
> > don't have any idea what FAITH is.
>
I would correct this to say that contemporary Westerners do not have a clue about what Spirituality is, whether faith-based or not. It is rather amusing to see all the effort tha Dawkins and his ilk pour into condemning religion when all they exhibit is a loathing for Monotheism, as if that constituted the only modern expression of spirituality
> When I read what we say about faith, it
> > strikes me as blind men discussing colors. We cannot imagine what it
> means to
> > live by, to feel FAITH.
>
I agree that this is so, when Faith is used to refer to someone else's
religious interpretation.
But I believe that every westerner, whether he has active condemnation or
just ignorance as a reason, has Faith. It is just that modern people
associate Faith with spirituality and condemn it, but have simply
transferred that irrational belief to subjects other than religion
> We are afraid of people who experience it, we flee them
> > as they feel so odd, "weird" to us.
>
Not always. From fanatics, yes, as we all should shun all fanatics
> As someone who has never had faith I'm not afraid of the few I've known who
> really have it.
> Faith can best be described as a complete certainty in your vision of the
> world.
Julian corrected this misconception.
This world view of certainty sounds to me more like the scientific world
view.
Not that it knows everything, but that it can know everything
Science as a religion, called sciencism, is a widespread faith these days in
the modern west
It is often reinforced by experience or revelation.
yep.
for both religion, and science
> The people who are scary are those who proclaim
> their faith but do not live it. I'm sure Glorantha has its share of those.
>
Fewer, since the cycle of belief and practice and response is much, much stronger in Glorantha
> > Back to Glorantha : in malkioni lands, Faith comes from KNOWLEDGE.
> Knowledge
> > repeated to you by your readers, week after week. Knowledge that comes
> from
> > looking at the pictures on churches' stained glass windows, at the
> statues of
> > Saints. Knowledge that God made the Universe Perfect and that devolution
> made it
> > what it is today. Knowledge that you will live Perfection again after you
> die.
> > But also knowledge that comes from watching the World, the cycle of
> Seasons, the
> > laugther of children, the beauty of Nature. It's all you have as a
> malkioni :
> > your Faith.
>
and your practice, and the miracle of life unfolding before your eyes and in your daily life
> If you have faith it is all you need.
>
need for what?
> > Of course, not Knowing Faith doesn't stop us from building a wonderful
> fantasy
> > world with plenty of interesting stories to play and read, of course. But
> I
> > suspect that, paradoxically, we will never emulate malkioni life as well
> as we
> > do the pagans'. Because we do not know Faith.
>
Whereas, I guess, we all know theism and animism... :D
But you hit the key
Imagination, my friends
imagination
Faith is essential to the theistic religions as well - faith in the Gods.
> That Orlanth will help
> you fight for freedom, that Ernalda will welcome you home and feed you.
> Lose that faith and
> you will not be able to draw on the magic you need to survive.
>
Nope.
You can hate a part of your divine self and deny it totally, spend your life
cursing and denying it, and it will still be there. Doing all that negative
stuff transforms it to its negative self, of course--spirit of reprisal,
curse, broken sword, whatever...
I'm less sure about the animists but there seems to be an element of faith
> in the rituals that
> individual spirits need performed.
>
Nonsense
The world is alive, anyone can see that.
If you communicate with it in (this) way, it responds in (that) way.
an invisible power that holds all of "us" together
It extends into every facet of life, and everyone performs certain regular
acts to interact with it
No one can survive without this power in their life in some way
everyone carries around icons of their faith
discernable, though vague, entities control vast portions of this invisible
power
some people can interact directly with these great powers for personal or
collective benefit
Ha ha ha, what superstition. What foolish mortals believe such crap? But it
is the best our naive, uneducated ancestors cold do, right?
Nope
That is our modern economic system
not some ancient mythology
You believe in the modern economic system? I say "you have Faith."
--
Greg Stafford
Game Designer
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