Me>>Voria does not "stay home and is peaceful". She is born in Hell
>>and dances the rights of spring with High King Elf. She is
>>closer to the pagan Easter Goddess than the Goddess of Needlework
>>and Embroidery.
>So what function does Voria play in Orlanthi culture? What exactly does
>one worship the Goddess of Spring for?
To enhance the growing powers manifest in spring.
>Surely not just the start of
>Spring, because that has nothing to do with children.
And Voria is not a children's goddess. The Orlanthi use female children in her rites because they are most appropiate to worship her (being young and innocent).
> In a culture where
>social functions are expressed through cults, a cult of children must play
>some social function associated with children.
Social functions are not expressed through cults in Orlanthi society, they are expressed through the individual and the clan first and foremost. Orlanthi do not drop their kids to receive cult training at the local vorian school, they teach their own kids with the assistance of their stead and their clan officials (lawspeaker, god-talkers etc).
>>>I was unaware of this facet of Esrolian culture. Is it documented
>>>somewhere that the cult has no male worshippers in Esrolia?
>>It's a fact that only women join Babeester Gor. Esrolia is
>>not likely to be an exception to this because they are more
>>feverent believers in the divide in sex-related tasks than
>>most Orlanthi are.
>You're making a circular argument here. According to your previous
>response, "Yet there are no male worshippers in
>Esrolia and it seems the best explanation is that Babeester
>admits none."
And I was criticizing your supposedly austere cult entry requirements for _men_ which you made to inhibit men from joining her cult on the grounds that Esrolian men would not be deterred by such yet it is a fact that no men worship Babeester Gor (which we know according to her short form writeup in Gods of Glorantha).
>>The initiation of a woman into Babeester Gor is different than
>>the general adulthood initiation of a women into Ernalda.
> My point exactly. Babeester Gor initiates are almost by default
>Ernalda initiates. Where's the problem?
Then it is redundant information like the following statements:
We already know it from the basic information of Orlanthi culture so there is little need to repeat it. By repeating it, you imply that there is some special relationship between the two that is above and beyond Ernalda's own relationships with her kin.
>>If true, should women expect to join Babeester Gor and Maran Gor
>>in their lifetime? I don't think so hence I feel it is a bit
>>much to impose such identifications on the respective cult.
>I'm sorry, but I don't follow you here. As I admitted before, the
>biological change model of initiation works better for the 'light' earth
>cults than the dark earth ones.
One could easily claim that Babeester Gor represents the trauma of adolescence in girls or that Maran Gor is a spinster and Ty Kora Tek the widow. Yet I do not believe that women join these cults when their personal circumstances make it possible.
>Maran Gor, who has to destroy her children represents a strong
>contrast to Ernalda, who nurtures them.
Maran Gor does not destroy her own children. She was a virgin and never took any lovers before she assumed the title of Gor.
>>Since Maran Gor acolytes can be fertile, it seems strong to suggest
>>Babeester Gor initiates have renounced fertility.
>Given all the debate on the list recently about Humakti fertility,
>why does it seem so probable that the 'dark' earth cults are fertile
>without difficulty?
There is an explicit statement in the Cult writeup of Maran Gor that her acolytes may have children but must sacrifice their sons to Maran Gor. Only priests of Maran Gor do not have children because they are forbidden love. Yet you require people less devoted to Babeester Gor (initiates) to _renounce_ their fertility.
Secondly Humakt is the Rune Owner of Death whereas Maran Gor and Babeester Gor are not. Even then he has one known son, Arkat. Virtually all of the Praxian males are initiated into Waha the butcher who boasts a connection to the death rune as strong as Maran Gor and Babeester Gor. Yet the Praxians are no less fecund for all that.
>What can the sacrifice of Fertility by an earth goddess mean
>except that her worshippers (at least ideally) renounce childbirth?
Yet Maran Gor female initiates are not required to make such an oath and must make a lesser one not to "directly till the soil or herd beasts for their livihood".
>Furthermore, Vorian priestesses have to be virgins.
Which represents the innocence of spring. Babeester Gor is not innocent.
>Overall, my biggest concern is to avoid a BG whose cult is nothing
>but a group of stereotypical man-hating bitches. Such an image feels too
>much like a teenage boy's vision of what a strong female warrior is like
>for my taste.
If you want a cult for strong female warriors, join Humakt or Vinga which most Orlanthi women do. Babeester Gor initiates are deliberately scary to deter people from even thinking about defiling the earth.
>Surely there must be women (and the occasional man) who have
>a sincere desire to defend and serve the earth without hating
>everything male and non-earth?
All Orlanthi defend and serve the earth.
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