At 04:19 PM 8/19/2002 +0200, you wrote:
>ST says that the Water Tribe sees Heler as a traitor, the apostate
>who changed side to join Orlanth. The consequence being that any Water
>Tribe member considers Helerites as ennemies...
>Well, since it would be difficult for a Heler-worshipping hero to avoid
>bodies of water or to ask forgivance to any river before crossing it,
Most water is generic water. The World is Made of Everything. Most water has not inherent animating power present under normal circumstances.
>I'm
>wondering about the presence of the Water Tribe in Dragon Pass and Maniria.
>My current PoV is that the real enmity would be between saltwater (bay,
>sea, ocean ?) entities and Helerites
The distinction is not significent here.
>(and even so, there may be still some
>sea-dwelling helerings in the South Coast of Maniria).
Many sailor and fisherman Helerites live in southern Maniria (and even more in Umathela)
>Is freshwater part
>of the Water Tribe (I do not need or want 'cosmic' answers, just the
Heortling
>ones) ?
Yes, it is.
>In Dragon Pass, it seems many rivers or lakes are in fact friendly
>toward the Storm Tribe : Engizi, his sons or brothers, Blue Lake (of course)
>in Maniria or even Choralinthor him/herself.
That is a fact.
>I'm mistaken in deciding that a Rain Lord (or whatever title Heler devotees
>decide to have) is in no danger if he tries to swim or cross by boat a
>lake, stream or river in this region ? I know Heler is mostly associated
>with rainwater, but I see helerites as also having a strong relationship
>with water in general. They may swim more regularly that 'traditional'
>Orlanthi, for example (for whom swift rivers are almost another realm).
Their problem comes when they encounter entities of the Water Tribe. In that case Choralintho would offer resistance to a Helerite.
>Another question I have is about the cycle of water in glorantha. In the RW,
>I think it's mostly : sun heats water, water evaporates, creates clouds,
>clouds migrate somewhere else, it rains and water flow domnhill to form
>rivers.
>What would be a Gloranthan explanation ?
>There is a friendly cloud/fog/mist goddess associated with Choralinthor
>Bay (I don't remember its name), who is supposed to be one of Heler's lovers.
I don't know of this entity off hand.
>Ithas ? Not Iphara the Murder Fog, but another associated with the bay,
>I think. Not the Uraya Fog Spirit also...
>Could it be that this goddess rises up, meets Heler (clouds above
Choralinthor).
Too much cause and effect. Heler is the Cloud God. He forms.
>From ther union come the many herds of sky sheeps, which live above Dragon
>Pass. Quite a beautiful sight for a Helering. There, from time to time, they
>lose their wool and it rains (what's the English verb for cutting the wool
from
>sheeps ? to shear ?). Bountiful Earth is fertilized by the rain, but a part
>flows away and forms rivers.
Yep.
>These rivers flow downhill, feeling the call of Magasta across the
>many miles of sea. Does that mean they are already subject to the Great
>Mover ?
Yes. If a river flows down hill, it is part of the Greatest River of All Time and Space.
>(yes, some players of mine _may_ ask such questions, and anyway, that's
>precisely the kind of thoughts that cross my mind while trekking in the
>Alps and crossing streams)
>Another explanation could be that after their defeat (thrinbarri ?),
>the Sea Gods were forced to regularly send hostages to the Storm Tribe.
>Elmal heats the sea (collects the hostages, as little daimones of water),
>Heler the Traitor gathers them into clouds, and release them some time
>later, where they joyfully escape their slavery and flow back towards the
>sea ... Certainly, seeing Heler as a collector of slaves may be a good
>reason to hate him.
The stories you offer are fine.
>Imagine an orlanthi clan having outlawed one of its member (from being
>to friendly with the lunars, if officially for another reason) and seeing
>him coming back a few years later as a tax or slave collector ? Yuck.
>
>
>And finally, about the Syphon River... Where does it flow into ? I mean, is
>there a hole in the ground (or cosmos) somewhere in the Print, from which
it can
>reach the Underworld (or somewhere else) ?
Yes, there is a large and very very deep hole in the big toe region.
>Is that the reason I have this impression that no Heortlander will use a
boat on
>it ? This old mad warrior may be a bit too 'rough' or even plain dangerous,
>subject to fits of temper, changing from placid river to raging maelstrom
in a
>moment as it senses Chaos nearby ? Can no propitiation calms it ? May it
be to
>mad to be reached or appeased (I quite like the idea of a river seen as a
>dangerous beast)
It is dangerous, but no more so than a normal river.
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