Re: The same good ol' question : what is Chaos ?

From: Joerg Baumgartner <joe_at_MlqGWFlVuFhaN_N5J-kNYXDzF75BWtkAzoly2RNX7LHFwwWM9JoCy_6OVy2XRqdefkEyoFIt>
Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2012 14:34:34 +0200 (CEST)

David Cake

> I think Cults of Terror implies that Arkats army did call the elves
> krjalki (pg 18), because the non-human enemies of Arkats army would
> almost certainly include elves (the elves being the main non-human allies
> of Nysalor), but it also says that this is due to Brithini ignorance and
> unfamiliarity with non-humans - the native Seshnelans who are familiar
> with elves presumably would not have made this mistake.

AFAIK, Arkat spent his childhood as an adoptee in an elf forest of Brithos, apparently exposed to atone for his unknown or unappropriate father. If he calls an enemy krjalki, he might have some justification due to their behavior or use of unfriendly magics.

> Yes, Dilis in particular is very much like a classic chaos nest, a
> reasonable sized geographical area known to plagued with chaos monsters.
> And we have historical examples, such as the Vampire Legions of Tanisor
> wiped out by Arkat in the first age.

Quite a lot of the chaos nests or heroes of Glorantha originate by anti-chaos heroes cursing or demonizing them to be such. Dorastor was cursed by Arkat, Dilis by Sog City Brithini, Brangbane by Sartar... Thed did it to herself, and drew Vadrus with her. The Boristi rationalize their tapping and chaos creations in a similar way.

> I do think there is a tendency for Western chaos to take a different form
> - chaos is more associated with moral error and deliberate acts of
> corruption in the West, and tends to be a bit more covert (ie Boristi,
> Chaos Monks, the Nameless man), similar to the way chaos in Pamaltela is
> more associated with single powerful very chaotic beings than with mobs
> of chaotics in Genertela. But it is a tendency, not a rule.

Western Chaos as e.g. pronounced by Zzabur (who claims the implosion of the Spike as one of his successes) or Arkat (Dorastor) or Talor (Telmori) is the externalising kind, and creates pretty standard and bad manifest Chaos.

Snake Pipe Hollow, the non-petrified parts of the Footprint, or the Devil's Swamp around the Block are manifest remains of defeated chaos biggies still causing nothing but trouble, stemming from the Gods War. They often are used as strongholds or refuges by unrelated chaotic creatures. The closest thing I can think of in the West are the Gates of Banir.

The Krjalki Bog in the Wastes or the Nargan desert are different in that they are the remains of important Chaos victories. (Arguably, Dorastor might be counted among these, too...) Any such places in the Vadeli empire of Endernef were drowned by Banthe.

Finally, the eastern chaos nests of the kralori Huan To, Ignorance or the Andinni places are somewhat similar to Ramalia, Vampire Kings' Tanisor or parts of the Kingdom of War, or Ompalam's Fonrit, and probably the Vadeli places. Aspects of the Lunar Empire and Loskalm during its campaign against the Kingdom of War fit this bill, too.

The Lunars might agree with my old statement that Praxians and Orlanthi are active worshippers of Chaos in their rites - many of their magics depend on Chaos as a motivator. Surprisingly, the purification rites of the Westerners helped create some of the greates Chaos, too, and continue to do so.            

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