The origin of Ogres.

From: Peter Metcalfe <metcalph_at_AeASbbemIisT6OiiJsAez776iLQgMTbtIaUoPsQK-w_LJ_c9Ud1Ly1P8jPVSPp1a7ki>
Date: Sun, 27 Nov 2011 22:37:29 +1300

My personal thinking is that Ogres are cacodemons wrapped in flesh - instead of a human soul, they have a tiny little cacodemon instead. When the Devil was killed, he left behind demonic remnants (Gods of Glorantha: Prosopaedia) which hid themselves inside humans. The Elder Races Book (p90) supports this somewhat with the Ogres claiming that their god is temporarily taking refuge in the world to reform it to its original image. This explains the nature of Cacodemon's magics which is largely about concealing themselves plus the vomit acid spell.

Most ogres practice secret cannibalism because they are monsters at heart and being horrible to other people while hiding their true selves is in their nature. An Orlanthi Jurist might claim their real crime was secret murder rather than cannibalism. It is not necessary for an Ogre to be a cannibal; all that is required is that their crime be repugnant.

Can a human become an Ogre? Simon Hibbs made the argument to the effect that carrying out cannibalism was destructive to the soul and eventually the cannibal will become an Ogre. My general belief is that acquisition of a chaotic nature can only come about through a magical ritual or to put it simply: one cannot become chaotic through bad works alone, one must have magical change _and_ bad works. A human who practices cannibalism by himself will not become an Ogre, the same human when he joins the local cacodemon society might.

David Cake made the interesting observation about the Ogres of Gaumata's Vision. My thinking is that as the Succubi are associated with Seseine, any Ogre offspring would be associated with Vovisibor rather than Cacodemon.

Lastly Peter Larsen brought up the Ravenous movie. My problem with translating that to Glorantha is that the Wendigo taboo (like pretty much all taboos) is one of absolute liability. If one performs the act, then the taboo has been broken _regardless_ of intention: Boyd still became touched by the Wendigo even though he was eating from an already dead body to save himself. If a god promotes a cannibalistic rite then the god is promoting a chaotic rite. It's like incest; it doesn't matter if you didn't know the person was closely related to you - it's still disgustingly icky and you should be ashamed of yourself. If you require a guilty mind to go with the action, then what you have is no longer a taboo but something closer in spirit to criminal legislation. While I could accept some gloranthan religions (ie the Kralori and the Malkioni) be concerned with the rightness or wrongness of one's thought, I find it difficult to believe that Chaos would be so dependent on one's mental state.

--Peter Metcalfe